Would Millwall have a bigger ticket allocation if not for Palace Ultras?

The Palace Ultras The Palace Ultras

MILLWALL columnist MATT LITTLE feels the pre-match antics of the Palace Ultras ahead of this Saturday’s derby is the main reason why the Lions have been handed a reduced ticket allocation at Selhurst Park.

AS you read this there is a hive of activity going on in a garage in suburbia somewhere.

In this garage a ‘highly provocative’ (their words, not mine) banner is being spray painted by Crystal Palace fans for the benefit of visiting Millwall fans.

Ironically this is one of the reasons the police have reduced our allocation - because of the nature of this new fan culture among a section of home fans at Selhurst Park.

I say ironic because we do have our own fan culture at Millwall that does cause the police problems, but this has never been the case for our visits to Palace.

I have never known Millwall to take what would be known in hooligan parlance as a ‘firm’ to Selhurst Park in all the years I’ve been going, which is more than 25.

Yes, there have been minor incidents, but for such a nearby derby fixture involving up to sometimes 6,000 away fans they have been just that – minor.

So after all those years of calling us nasty names from their high horses it is actually the Palace fans under police scrutiny.

What cost turning the once sterile and silent Selhurst Park into a mini San Siro then?

Well, quite a lot by the looks of it, what with police escorts for home fans, road blocks and ticket reductions for away fans.

The board at Millwall would dearly love to be able to allow as many away fans as possible at The Den and reduce our astronomical police bill.

However, we are forced to turn away 4,000 potential customers in both home and away sections for high profile games such as the play-offs or against the likes of Leeds and West Ham.

Thankfully common sense prevailed with the last visit of Charlton, another fixture which doesn’t get the juices of our more volatile fans going either.

The police recognise this and give us the rare chance to maximise the crowd without too much fuss.

Yet Palace are seemingly happy to, if not encourage, then at least not dissuade this element that are starting to cost them money.

They know Millwall and Brighton would take up as many tickets as possible, but now the police will not allow that.

I am not sure of the situation with Charlton, but I assume it will be similar for their away allocation.

Ironically (again) this isn’t because these so-called Ultras are serious hooligans, but they act in such a way that they could provoke a negative response in high profile fixtures against the likes of us, Brighton and Charlton.

This blog compared their behaviour being akin to your little sister blowing raspberries at you from behind your dad’s legs last season – and we all know that we are capable of throwing a bit of tantrum when we see that.

This leads me back to this provocative banner (again, their words not mine) being made by these admirers of European fan culture.

I’m not going to mock them this year, we’ve all done stupid things when we were younger, although mine involved beer goggles and getting slaps from bouncers, rather than being on YouTube waving camp banners and singing even camper songs. But each to their own.

But what on earth are they trying to achieve?

Apparently it’s about Crystal Palace being against racism.

Scratching your head?

Yeah, I know.

This is meant to be an insult.

The only thing it is insulting is people’s intelligence.

Last time I checked no player has ever left Millwall because of a racist rant by one of our chairmen.

Unfortunately Palace cannot claim the same.

It is an insult to all the people that work so tirelessly at Millwall to counter racism, people that have been recognised by Kick It Out for their outstanding work and dedication, as well as being an inspiration to other clubs – given that it’s supposed to be a cheap shot at us.

Millwall are a small football club playing in 21st century inner-city London and all the problems that that entails.

I’m not sure if the opinions of some teenagers from the suburbs are that relevant to us or those of Daily Mail readers either.

Anyway, what a disgrace it is to trivialise racism and use it as a currency in tedious football ‘banter’ in this way.

Almost as bad as Marvin Sordell not taking his claim of racism seriously enough to actually report it to the numerous police officers and stewards present at the time, instead being almost blasé about it on Twitter hours later.

In fact it’s interesting the way the media have missed the real story behind the Sordell claims.

Why hasn’t Marvin been asked about his lack of action at the time?

He wasn’t playing so had plenty of opportunity and time to make an official compliant. Also where are all the ‘Millwall AND police in racism accusations’ headlines?

He is after all claiming the police ignored the alleged abuse.

Then again I am a historian rather than a journalist, so perhaps look at things a little differently.

Indeed I would argue headlines like ‘Millwall fans racially abuse Marvin Sordell’ as just a bit misleading.

It conjures up images of the whole stadium involved in monkey chants or the like when in reality the allegations are levelled at an individual.

Anyway, back to this banner rumour - it could be the usual internet nonsense.

Yet enough posters on Palace’s message-boards felt it was a ‘good idea’ if true and ‘funny’.

Perhaps it will be the now legendary ‘south London is ours’ motif that they are so proud of instead?

This would only be provocative if Palace fans had travelled in decent numbers to The Den over the last 50 years.

But as they haven’t it’s just more raspberry blowing from them.

I think the final irony is whatever this banner says it will say far more about them than it does us.

Follow us on Twitter @NewsShopperSprt

Comments(27)

NewDense says...
5:40pm Fri 19 Oct 12

Great insight Matt. Can't believe the nationals haven't spotted you yet? Surely only a matter of time.

delboy01 says...
6:02pm Fri 19 Oct 12

Sadly your entire blog is based on an incorrect fact. The allocation was reduced to due to police restrictions as they don't have enough man power to police more than 2600 millwall due to the TUC march and the Spuds V chelski game. It wasn't difficult to find this out but I suppose that wont make good reading! And I Iove the way you always claim to be sweet and innocent misunderstood fans. There are more seats broken and toilets smashed when you lot visit than for the rest of the season put together.

LittleByLittle says...
6:50pm Fri 19 Oct 12

NewDense wrote:
Great insight Matt. Can't believe the nationals haven't spotted you yet? Surely only a matter of time.
Yeah, maybe..it would have to be a pretty good offer to match my current income..as I'm not a journalist, this is just a blog.

I think I have what it takes for The Sun though.

LittleByLittle says...
7:01pm Fri 19 Oct 12

delboy01 wrote:
Sadly your entire blog is based on an incorrect fact. The allocation was reduced to due to police restrictions as they don't have enough man power to police more than 2600 millwall due to the TUC march and the Spuds V chelski game. It wasn't difficult to find this out but I suppose that wont make good reading! And I Iove the way you always claim to be sweet and innocent misunderstood fans. There are more seats broken and toilets smashed when you lot visit than for the rest of the season put together.
Yes, they have reduced tickets because of that march...because this game is now, thanks to the 'Ultras', a higher category match.

Crikey, it's not that hard to do the joined up thinking, is it?

Furthermore, I am willing to bet Palace's valuation of Zaha that Brighton's and Charlton's allocations are reduced in a similar fashion.

Palace are losing their innocence in that respect. It wasn't that long ago you were able to host 6,000 fans of the most horrible, thuggish club going.

As for claiming we're misunderstood and sweet and innocent - do you mean the bit where I say we do have a culture that does cause the police problems or the bit where I say we have volatile fans?

Even the bit about racism doesn't claim we are innocent - it says a bunch of teenagers from the suburbs can't really add anything to the debate about a small inner city football club's fight with racism. Unless you know different?

The fact you call Chelsea and Tottenham Hotspur by silly playground names makes wonder why I've even bothered replying to you.

More fool me.

delboy01 says...
7:55pm Fri 19 Oct 12

Sorry just have to pick you up again. You say 'if we travelled in numbers'. But we always sell out our upper tier allocation as you yourself say the lower tier is not available to us. Why? Our fans? Don't think so. Its not available most games. And it was like that long before the HF were even formed. The HF held up a banner in support of Cardiff fans earlier on in the season. 'Bluebirds extinct because of your greed'. Its got nothing to do wit the ultras. Read the statement. You reap what you sow as they say.

LittleByLittle says...
8:28pm Fri 19 Oct 12

It is available to you - the only clubs not allowed in the lower tier are West Ham and Leeds.

Arsenal, Spurs, Everton, Liverpool, Wolves, Bristol City, Carlisle, Nottingham Forest, Norwich City, Charlton and Brighton have all had fans in the lower tier.

The reason the likes of Barnsley haven't been in the Lower Tier is merely down to the fact the away end holds 4,000 people - they've never had cause to use it.

West Ham have been in the lower tier, but it was the action of their fans that sure them banned from future use - apparently they didn't like us laughing at them as we handed out a 4-1 beating.

Leeds are equally distrusted to behave.

But Palace are free to buy tickets in the Lower Tier should they wish - they're a lower category risk than the likes of Everton, Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs, Bristol City, Wolves and Forest.

We'd love it if you did - Millwall's average attendences have been massively hindered by lack of away fans. We'd have averaged nearer to 14,500 last season if Leeds, West Ham had of been allowed a full allocation, and the likes of Palace brought numbers reflecting a derby (Chesterfield take 4,000 to Notts County for example) and the likes of Wolves, Forest, Leicester took similar numbers to what they take to other clubs.

Our average attendance is the highest percentage of home fans in the league. Pity, cos it's only because of our rep - The Den is actually a good away day, as more and more are commenting on...good drinking around Borough, London's most central club along with Arsenal, and easy to get to.

Be great to see more Palace fans at The Den.

Oldchap says...
9:17pm Fri 19 Oct 12

"Millwall's average attendances have been massively hindered by lack of away fans"

Have you stopped to think why?

LittleByLittle says...
9:46pm Fri 19 Oct 12

We know why.

We have the worst supporter reputation in the country.

That's why I say our ticket reduction over the last few seasons at Selhurst Park is ironic.

Yes we have our problems - the club is very open about that...yet we have never really had a hooligan rivalry with either of our closest clubs. However, this fixture has now moved up a category at Selhurst Park as the Ultras have added something to the fixture that the police will worry about.

The police won't say 'hey, these Ultras are just young lads trying to create a bit of atmosphere, so let's leave it at that'...there are no grey areas with the police.

Have you stopped to think why the following has happened -

Millwall v Charlton will see both sets of fans fill ever seat available should they want too.

Millwall at home will allow Palace the whole of the North Stand.

Palace at home to us, Brighton and Charlton will see reduced allocations and precautions such as road blocks put in place.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there a no go area put in place in the Arthur Wait stand for all fixtures now?

Have a think and get back to me.

LittleByLittle says...
9:48pm Fri 19 Oct 12

* Re Charlton & Millwall I meant both fixtures will see that all seats will be available - no ticket restrictions.

soutise10 says...
10:30pm Fri 19 Oct 12

What an interesting read. Sports journalism at it's best. I think you're aiming too low, you're definitely better than the back pages of The Sun. Page 3 would be more appropriate. Have a great day, little person ;-)

LittleByLittle says...
10:53pm Fri 19 Oct 12

Editor - I told you we needed a rider on here.

This is a Blog. A blog for Millwall fans.

Every week I have to explain this to some dimwit with the comprehension skills of a 6 year old.

Soutise is this weeks winner - your prize is a party bag of blue and red balloons, a bag of haribo and some face paint. I know you'll put these to good use big man.

soutise10 says...
11:10pm Fri 19 Oct 12

Errm. So now that people are reading your tawdry little blog and taking the time to respond, you're calling on mummy (aka 'Editor') to intervene. Sadly your witterings are out there on the Internet where everyone can see them (not just Millwall fans!). Did mummy not tell you?

LittleByLittle says...
12:11am Sat 20 Oct 12

Ha. Not that bright are you, Soutise.

My point was it's a blog...a blog for Millwall fans.

Not a serious bit of sports journalism for you to get so upset about.

I don't mind you or any other Palace fan commenting on it - but I will take the **** or explain there's no reason to get angry - it's just a blog.

Why am I explaining all this to you - you know, right, you Palace boys are the bright ones...you all go to 6th Form and such..that's where you learn how to make banners and choreograph yourselves I thought.

soutise10 says...
12:27am Sat 20 Oct 12

Deary me. Never realised a few idle comments about a football blog could cause such emotion.

Have you ever considered a career in theatre? There's a part in a panto in Brighton thats coming up. I reckon would be perfect for you. Its called the Bitter Spinster from Bermondsey. All gusset and no trousers. Interested?

JimboCPFC says...
9:39am Sat 20 Oct 12

There's been a reduced allocation for 2 seasons now, nothing to do with the young and un-threatening 'ultra's' you talk about.

It's because you have the scumiest fans in the country, 'live by the sword' and all that! You say no trouble but that's a lie, I've seen young kids attacked by your fans for no reason.

Bigger club, better players, bigger attendances, better fans. Living in the shadow of us for 25 years, must be hard for little Millwall.

LittleByLittle says...
11:14am Sat 20 Oct 12

Look boys (and it always is boys isn't it...never get many upset girls leaving messages) I'll admit...this is a Millwall blog for Millwall fans and this one was a thinly concealed attempt to wind up the stereotypical Palace fan...

You know, spotty nerd from the suburbs, has a chip on his shoulder, gets all righteous online, wouldn't say boo to a goose in real life, thinks Palace are the 'Arsenal of south London'.

That kinda of Palace. Only for our amusement of course.

Now, I know you're not those types. You're proper Palace. So don't bite. We need to keep room for all the really hysterical Palace fans..the Nigel types. If you beat us I'm sure they'll be pounding the keyboards all night....it's them I'm interesting in landing.

LittleByLittle says...
11:17am Sat 20 Oct 12

*interested of course.

Sorry, I got all excited just thinking about greasy haired nerds in stripy tops from Penge abusing me online all day and night.

I hear Alan Dunne enjoys it too.

Kinky.

Oldchap says...
4:35pm Sat 20 Oct 12

LittleByLittle wrote:
Editor - I told you we needed a rider on here.

This is a Blog. A blog for Millwall fans.

Every week I have to explain this to some dimwit with the comprehension skills of a 6 year old.

Soutise is this weeks winner - your prize is a party bag of blue and red balloons, a bag of haribo and some face paint. I know you'll put these to good use big man.
"A blog for Millwall fans"

So are you saying only Millwall fans are entitled to make comments?

LittleByLittle says...
4:58pm Sat 20 Oct 12

As for the banner Ultras.

Very good lads.

I can imagine the scene now - in some garage in Penge.

The spotty Palace fans all in their stripy tops, spraying away after finishing 6th Form, and in comes one of their mums...

'Oh, that's nice lads, you do work hard for your little fan club...here's your milk and biscuits, soya for you Eugene'.

All the Ultras in unison - 'Thanks Mrs Nigelton'.

Marty1979 says...
7:24pm Sat 20 Oct 12

Suggest Mr Little has a look at a MILLWALL forum

If that's not blatant racist I dont' know what is

http://www.millwall.
vitalfootball.co.uk/
forum/forums/thread-
view.asp?tid=99520&p
osts=8

Oldchap says...
7:43pm Sat 20 Oct 12

LittleByLittle wrote:
*interested of course.

Sorry, I got all excited just thinking about greasy haired nerds in stripy tops from Penge abusing me online all day and night.

I hear Alan Dunne enjoys it too.

Kinky.
Then only abuse on here seems to be from you

EverardEdbutt says...
12:39pm Mon 22 Oct 12

Millwall fan's behaved disgracefully on Saturday, throwing flares, coins, bottles and fruit.
Targeted a woman in a wheelchair with her child and threw fruit at her.
Hit 2 teenagers with coins, splitting ones eyebrow open!
This happened at Norwood Junction.
Perhaps Millwall should be forced to play behind closed doors.
The loss of revenue will surely make the club address the hooligan element among their supporters!

Matthew Harding 26/12/1953 - 22/10/1996 RIP Always Loved - Never Forgotten!!!
KTBFFH!!
CTID!!
BITC!!

wakeupman says...
6:42pm Tue 23 Oct 12

Laughable this report, i think he thinks supporting millwall in some way makes him a bit of a lad, its evident the way he looks for attention and how he writes his anything but one,much more likely to fit in down selhurst way. Wake up Matthew your a nice boy not anything like the old Bermondsey boys of old. Get back to your playstation and moaning to mum

wakeupman says...
6:43pm Tue 23 Oct 12

Laughable this report, i think he thinks supporting millwall in some way makes him a bit of a lad, its evident the way he looks for attention and how he writes his anything but one,much more likely to fit in down selhurst way. Wake up Matthew your a nice boy not anything like the old Bermondsey boys of old. Get back to your playstation and moaning to mum

wakeupman says...
8:27am Wed 24 Oct 12

Just been confirmed by a mate who sits near Matthew who validated what we all thought, a bit on the geeky side and has a awkward look about him. My strong belief is somewhere down the line Matthew has been bullied and it was dear dads idea to toughen him up by introducing Matthew to the delights of Millwall even though i would suspect he is from Bromley or some other suburb. Rod Liddle in the making . Be down Stuarts soon trying to get some garb to fit in.

reasonable75 says...
3:31pm Wed 24 Oct 12

No answers yet

Toolbox69 says...
1:52pm Thu 25 Oct 12

A good piece and some good responses to those who have commented. I particularly love the tone that it is Palace who caused Millwall's allocation to be reduced, and it is West Ham's and Leeds' fault entirely that means they cannot have the bootom tier.

I supppose it was Luton Town's fault that Millwall invaded their pitch and smashed the palce up, and it was the away team's fault that the area surrounding The New Den was smashed up following a play-off semi final defeat. Oh, maybe we could put that last one down to the police.

Last comment. I took my nephew to watch Millwall v Stoke City in 2003. He was 11 at the time. I recall the delight that as West Ham's demise that season drew nearer, some most pleasant Millwall fans running around outside the ground relishing the though of "doing" West Ham the following season rather than enjoying their just finished 3-0 victory! My nephew learnt some new language that afternoon which I firmly told him not to repeat in front of his monther!

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