BROMLEY: Rubbish pick-up changes (From News Shopper)

Slightly misleading there: "Bin collection to be fortnightly"

If it's like what we've got already in our road, two of the bins will be fortnightly, the other two (including the one with the cat- and rat-friendly stuff) weekly.

Granted, though, it makes for a less punchy headline...

'Fortnightly collections are unpopular and unhygienic. It's the traditional weekly bin round people want' - Eric Pickles June 2010.

So what's Changed?

I have two small children who use nappies. I have tried the reusable ones, and - to put it bluntly - they are useless. I put all solid matter from the nappies down the toilet. I wrap up all of my nappies in a bag tightly, using carrier bags that we are supposed to be cutting down on.

But still I get maggots in my bins in the summer months.

So how do I stop this becoming completely gross over two weeks - Counsellor Colin Smith? May I ask what type of house you live in? I have a very small garden, and if i leave the bins there for two weeks, my en tire garden will stink and have flies around it.

This is quite literally - rubbish

“The money saved also helps to protect vital public services" Cllr Colin Smith.

Bin collection IS one of the VITAL PUBLIC SERVICES.

Nothing's changed JCA. The headline is extremely unhelpful in it's use of the word "Fortnightly" which the new system emphatically isn't.

On average you used to get 4 collections every two weeks, under the arrangements you get 6.

All you have to do differently is put foodstuffs, chicken carcases and anything else which might potentially smell in a different (airtight, lockable, rodent proof) box, which is still collected weekly.

Have a look at the Council's website in respect of nappies and it will give you a range of options if you have an aversion to double bagging them (which I have to say seems to work well enough for most people)

Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear.

Whether you've got a big garden or small (mine's a medium sized semi for what it's worth, but my mother-in-law's who has been in the trial area's is a tiny terraced one) if the waste is presented properly, there is no reason at all why flies will appear.

But don't take my word for it, ask those already using the system.

It comes recommended with a truly amazing 74% for, 7% against approval rating.

Thake a quantum leap of faith, the cup is half full.

Hmm - I wonder how Bromley Council would react if I announced that I'm going to start paying my council tax every other month to save money and protect my income.

Cllr Colin Smith wrote:
Nothing's changed JCA. The headline is extremely unhelpful in it's use of the word "Fortnightly" which the new system emphatically isn't.

On average you used to get 4 collections every two weeks, under the arrangements you get 6.

All you have to do differently is put foodstuffs, chicken carcases and anything else which might potentially smell in a different (airtight, lockable, rodent proof) box, which is still collected weekly.

Have a look at the Council's website in respect of nappies and it will give you a range of options if you have an aversion to double bagging them (which I have to say seems to work well enough for most people)

Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear.

Whether you've got a big garden or small (mine's a medium sized semi for what it's worth, but my mother-in-law's who has been in the trial area's is a tiny terraced one) if the waste is presented properly, there is no reason at all why flies will appear.

But don't take my word for it, ask those already using the system.

It comes recommended with a truly amazing 74% for, 7% against approval rating.

Thake a quantum leap of faith, the cup is half full.

I'm sorry Colin - you are saying that flies eggs take 11 days - This is just wrong!

One Day (source : http://www.justbajan
.com/health/articles
/flyeggs/index.htm
or
http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Housefly). A fly can lay 75-150 in a batch. These hatch in one day to a maggot. So you have based this two weekly policy on a 11 day period, but this is wrong. So are you going to re-visit the policy on inaccurate facts assumed by the council?

Could you please quote your source which states that its 11 days?

Trust me - I do the double wrapping etc. I get flies.

I have very little food waste in my bins, as I have two dogs, and they eat pretty much any left overs.

Like I said - Bin collection is a vital service. You are dressing it up saying nothing has changed. It has!!

Non recyclable rubbish is going to be collected every two weeks. At present it it every week. So your quote that "Nothing's changed JCA" is false. Along with your spin that it takes 11 days for an egg to hatch

Hope this helps

http://www.vtaide.co
m/png/housefly.htm

Cllr Colin Smith wrote:
Nothing's changed JCA. The headline is extremely unhelpful in it's use of the word "Fortnightly" which the new system emphatically isn't.

On average you used to get 4 collections every two weeks, under the arrangements you get 6.

All you have to do differently is put foodstuffs, chicken carcases and anything else which might potentially smell in a different (airtight, lockable, rodent proof) box, which is still collected weekly.

Have a look at the Council's website in respect of nappies and it will give you a range of options if you have an aversion to double bagging them (which I have to say seems to work well enough for most people)

Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear.

Whether you've got a big garden or small (mine's a medium sized semi for what it's worth, but my mother-in-law's who has been in the trial area's is a tiny terraced one) if the waste is presented properly, there is no reason at all why flies will appear.

But don't take my word for it, ask those already using the system.

It comes recommended with a truly amazing 74% for, 7% against approval rating.

Thake a quantum leap of faith, the cup is half full.

Hi Colin, could you also provide the link for "range of options" for nappies. All I can see is the "Real Nappy" option, which we tried, and believe me they do not work, they are way to bulky, and leak - Alot!). I have no aversion to double bagging, I currently do it. I was just pointing out the juxtaposition of what the public are being told about reducing plastic waste from carrier bags, and then using 8-12 a day per child for nappies, as double bagging requires two!).

Also, and I do hope this is a positive, what is the situation with butter pots, yoghurt containers etc? Are these now recyclable, or will they only be collected every two weeks? Same goes for tetrapak style juice cartons? Are they recyclable. At present only really pop bottles and similar are recyclable - is this still the case?

I am very, very pro recycling. I have two compost bins, which I use daily. I recycle everything I can. I take clothes to the bank, shoes etc. I take old batteries to Sainsbury for re-cycling etc. So I do my bit.

I just don't want maggots (in one day!) in my garden.

Cllr Colin Smith wrote:
Hope this helps

http://www.vtaide.co

m/png/housefly.htm

Your link quite clearly states that a fly will lay an egg and be a maggot in 24 hours?

You say "Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear."

??? The life cycle is around two weeks, but maggots appear after 24 hours - read your own link????

JCA

I'm trying to get you some better information and feedback on 'Maggots' I agree its an important and emotive subject.

If you stop to think about it, if maggots were a problem after a day, they would already be rampant in our dustbins under the existing arrangements

Regarding nappies, please have a look at this :



and this

Cllr Colin Smith wrote:
JCA

I'm trying to get you some better information and feedback on 'Maggots' I agree its an important and emotive subject.

If you stop to think about it, if maggots were a problem after a day, they would already be rampant in our dustbins under the existing arrangements

Regarding nappies, please have a look at this :



and this

Many people do get maggots under existing arrangement. But it will be a whole load worse under two weekly collections.

BTW - your links seem to have failed as there is nothing there.

Also I have looked through Bromley website, its very hard to find ANY info on this change. It should be MUCH more prominent. I eventually got the link (http://www.bromley.
gov.uk/environment/r
ecycling/composting_
for_all.htm) which only mentions it as a trial. May I suggest a more prominent and obvious article on the home page for such a big change?

Hmmm. Seems they didn't carry across for whatever reason.

Try this one...I'm hopeful you'll find it fairly easy to navigate round the various questions/links:

http://www.bromley.g
ov.uk/environment/re
cycling/changes_to_r
efuse_and_recycling_
collections_in_the_t
rial_area_faqs.htm

Cllr Colin Smith wrote:
Hmmm. Seems they didn't carry across for whatever reason.

Try this one...I'm hopeful you'll find it fairly easy to navigate round the various questions/links:

http://www.bromley.g

ov.uk/environment/re

cycling/changes_to_r

efuse_and_recycling_

collections_in_the_t

rial_area_faqs.htm

That link does offer allot of advise, but again - anyone coming to the site would see it as just a trial, as it mentions only 4,500 households.

This need to changed to reflect that the whole area is going to have it happening in a few weeks time? Should this info not have been updated and live on the website before (or at least the same time) as any press release?

The opening line of the waste management website states "We collect your waste weekly and your recycling materials fortnightly". Well this is clearly not going to be true in a few weeks. Nothing there appears to mention anything apart from the trial.

Listen, it could be worse. Bromley Council could have offered Bromley residents a small rebate in our council tax and told us to go and find our own refuse collectors. I think its called 'Direct Payments'.

JCA, to try and pick your points up roughly in order..

If you take a step back and think about it, nothing
really has (changed)

Years ago we used to shove everything in the same bin (including bottles, glass, paper and plastic)and it was all collected weekly.

Then, recycling came along. At that stage we proceeded to take paper, bottles, tins and plastics out of the dustbin which still got collected weekly, and put them in the green and black boxes which got collected every second week.

We continued to collect the dustbins weekly for the obvious (and agreed) reason that the residual waste left in it due to its nature.

What we are doing here builds on that.

We are now taking out the food waste and everything smelly and are collecting that weekly (in the same way it was being collected from the dustbin) and are upgrading the black box service to weekly at the same time.

To offset that, we are now collecting what's left in the dustbin (which should all be inert, nappies (possibly) and pet waste aside)every second week instead
of the paper, and collecting that at the same time as the Green box recyling.

In summary, instead of having inert paper laying around for two weeks, you will now have inert rubbish laying around in stead.

As I say, and you are welcome to the detailed report on the subject, the system works, and and works well, enjoying a massive approval rating of 74 to 7.

I accept my opening comment of the fly to maggot lifespan was very poorly worded bordering on plain wrong for which I apologise (though they aren't a problem) and will get back to you on this as soon as I've gathered the information to hand which I'm looking for which explains what I was trying to convey more clearly.

The website is still in the process of being updated as this decision was only finalised last week. Detailed information has been prepared which will be circlated to every house in the Borough during the week beginning 20th September.

As an aside , about 25,000 homes already operate the new system and have doneb in some cases for 2 years now.

I'll get back to you on a separate posting about plastic recycling. It's detailed and will be a fairly long post.

Re Plastics, I'll actually have to go for the abridged version if you'll forgive me as time is pressing on and I have to get on with some case work.

There will be more on this on the website shortly.

The reason we collect plastic bottles is because most plastic bottles are made from plastic grades '1' '2' & '3' which can be mixed together and recycled.

Most 'other' shapes (yoghurt pots, margarine tubs etc..) are made of different grades which can't be mixed together with the bottles as it corrupts the purity and the integrity of the reformed product.

Despite the apparent self contradiction
we are though now offering residents the choice (and I emphaise choice) of placing yoghurt pots etc in their green box alongside plastic bottles and the other materials.

We still can't recycle anything other than plastic bottles (for the time being the UK recycling market doesn't find it cost effective to do so commercially) meaning the materially has to be subsequently re-sorted at the depot, with the lower grade items being sent to incineration (where it's calorific properties are released to produce green' electricity)

The reason for doing so is solely to offer residents greater choice as to how best to manage the space they have available for storing their waste/recycling bins.

There will obviously be different 'best' solutions for different households.

If anyone needs an extra green bin as part of this process, please ask, and it's yours.

Regarding Tetrapaks, no, the Council can't recycle them.

Although there are 5, or 6, collection points for them in the Borough (Waldo, Churchfields etc ..) the are provided by and operated by Tetrapak people themselves.

If they ever want to site more bins in the Borough we will be very pleased to host them but they limit us (and I understand others) to this number, presumably to make the function financially sustainable.

Hope that helps, any further questions, please fire away.

Maggots coming up next !

I have had this scheme in place for over a year now in Bromley Common. The increase in recycling greatly reduces the amount of general waste you have, our general bin is often practically empty even after a fortnight. We have a baby in nappies and a dog, so often place unmentionables in the bin. The prediction that this would cause an increase in maggots is nonsense!
There is a big problem with the scheme though. Whoever decided to collect paper every week but leave every single other piece of recycling to every two weeks is, for want of a better word, an idiot!
The paper box is the same size as the recycling box for other recycling. Paper is by it's very nature flat, tins, glass and plastics are not and often cannot be crushed down.
No matter how much junk and menus we get through our door we cannot fill the paper box in a week. The other box is full after 2 days and we have to wait 12 more before it is collected. You can see the streets in the trial as they are covered in old cans and yogurt pots which are just left by the full bin to blow away!
We have written to Bromley Council three times to say that if they want to do it this ridiculous way round then send us more bins. Not a single response.

Why thank you Colin, I take my hat off to you. You have changed my opinion of counsellors a bit. You have been honest, admitted mistakes, and provided useful info in a two way dialogue. Ta!

I still want weekly collection for my kids nappies, but I guess that's not gonna happen.

We have been in the trial area and had no problems although, as already mentioned, our plastic bin is filled quickly & we now have a second (some weeks we need 3!) which shows how much plastic is thrown out. I had not realised until I saw Colin's comments above that yoghurt pots etc are not recycled though.
Our kitchen waste has never had maggots of flies (perhaps as it's sem-sealed).
One other benefit is, even though general waste collection is only every 2 weeks, the bin is rarely more than half full

In light of this news, I plan on starting a petition or if anyone else is interested in collaborating and starting one. I live on the cusp of Bromley and Greenwich council yet, unfortunately come under Bromley borough. Greenwich council residents are provided with FREE wheely bins and large ones at that for all kinds of waste. I have had to buy my own rubbish bin, put up with tiny little recycling bins which end up overflowing (as clearly I am recycling well) and had to buy my own compost bin (perhaps I should send the receipt to BC).....anyway, if Greenwich council can manage it, then why can't Bromley? I am sick of all these excuses and it's about time someone stood up and did something constructive instead of moaning in the usual English way and then accepting it.

Also Greenwich council take all sorts of plastics and garden waste - for which bins are provided. Ihave asked for more bins, even though I have no space for them THREE times and still haven't received them. Terrible customer service at Bromley Council is all I can say...

Pigeon78 wrote:
In light of this news, I plan on starting a petition or if anyone else is interested in collaborating and starting one. I live on the cusp of Bromley and Greenwich council yet, unfortunately come under Bromley borough. Greenwich council residents are provided with FREE wheely bins and large ones at that for all kinds of waste. I have had to buy my own rubbish bin, put up with tiny little recycling bins which end up overflowing (as clearly I am recycling well) and had to buy my own compost bin (perhaps I should send the receipt to BC).....anyway, if Greenwich council can manage it, then why can't Bromley? I am sick of all these excuses and it's about time someone stood up and did something constructive instead of moaning in the usual English way and then accepting it.

Good point which I forgot! I had to pay for my own wheelie bin when I moved here! Glad someone else has mentioned the ridiculous size of the recycling bins and the lack of effort from Bromley Council to respond to requests.
Bromley Council do provide a compost bin though which I'm sure you'll receive shortly.

Readham wrote:

Pigeon78 wrote:
In light of this news, I plan on starting a petition or if anyone else is interested in collaborating and starting one. I live on the cusp of Bromley and Greenwich council yet, unfortunately come under Bromley borough. Greenwich council residents are provided with FREE wheely bins and large ones at that for all kinds of waste. I have had to buy my own rubbish bin, put up with tiny little recycling bins which end up overflowing (as clearly I am recycling well) and had to buy my own compost bin (perhaps I should send the receipt to BC).....anyway, if Greenwich council can manage it, then why can't Bromley? I am sick of all these excuses and it's about time someone stood up and did something constructive instead of moaning in the usual English way and then accepting it.

Good point which I forgot! I had to pay for my own wheelie bin when I moved here! Glad someone else has mentioned the ridiculous size of the recycling bins and the lack of effort from Bromley Council to respond to requests.
Bromley Council do provide a compost bin though which I'm sure you'll receive shortly.

They do supply bins, one of my two bins was supplied by Bromley.

I agree, the recycle bins are tiny! I always have to use extra bags. Also, they encourage litter all over the street as people over fill them and then when the bin man picks it up to load the van - they spill half of it on the street (paper and tins etc). Do they pick it back up - do they b***x! I asked one to one, I regretted that!

jca111 wrote:

Readham wrote:

Pigeon78 wrote:
In light of this news, I plan on starting a petition or if anyone else is interested in collaborating and starting one. I live on the cusp of Bromley and Greenwich council yet, unfortunately come under Bromley borough. Greenwich council residents are provided with FREE wheely bins and large ones at that for all kinds of waste. I have had to buy my own rubbish bin, put up with tiny little recycling bins which end up overflowing (as clearly I am recycling well) and had to buy my own compost bin (perhaps I should send the receipt to BC).....anyway, if Greenwich council can manage it, then why can't Bromley? I am sick of all these excuses and it's about time someone stood up and did something constructive instead of moaning in the usual English way and then accepting it.

Good point which I forgot! I had to pay for my own wheelie bin when I moved here! Glad someone else has mentioned the ridiculous size of the recycling bins and the lack of effort from Bromley Council to respond to requests.
Bromley Council do provide a compost bin though which I'm sure you'll receive shortly.

They do supply bins, one of my two bins was supplied by Bromley.

I agree, the recycle bins are tiny! I always have to use extra bags. Also, they encourage litter all over the street as people over fill them and then when the bin man picks it up to load the van - they spill half of it on the street (paper and tins etc). Do they pick it back up - do they b***x! I asked one to one, I regretted that!

above should have read supply compost bins - sorry

Readham,

Thank you for your generally supportive comments.

As 'Idiot in Chief' a quick word about the black box / green box situation.

Firstly, the Council is aware and does accept that some households suffer from from capacity issues with green Box, so are very keen where asked to provide an extra box, which do stack reasonabley well on top of each other if not fully filled.

If you would be kind enough to forward me any unactioned emails on this subject I shall be grateful and will deal with the matter for you.

The Council will also provided elasticated nets on request to stop the spillage issues you point towards, which can be problem in the wind.

(One of the reason lids were discontinued, obstruction of the highway being another)

You've seen upstring that you can place non plastic bottle waste in either your green box or the 'dustbin' now as best suits your circumstances.

If I could though just chuck into the debate at this point that stamping down green box waste (take great care with tins)for those who feel able to will help considerabley as well.

One thing that's often lost on people is that this isn't just about managing the waste materials themselves, it's as much about managing 'space'as all those little pockets of air from yoghurt pots upwards to the biggest dustbin testify.

On a final point on the black box vs green box question, you will be pleased to hear that the question is far from closed.

The bias towards collecting the black box is that when colelcted weekly it's been proven empirically to drive out @ 30% extra material (the implicit suggestion being that once full, a good deal was being shoved in the 'dustbin' of the average family home)

Being as heavy as it is, relative to the other recyclates, this is important as it helps disproportionately to avoid landfill tax (which is based on weight, rather than volume).

That said, we want a system that not only works well, but is as user friendly as possible, and with that in mind, once the programme has begun, we may well trial an area where we flip the black and green box collections to see whether it adversely impacts the post trial experience.

We are also looking carefully at the possibility of sourcing some all singing all dancing waste vehicles in due course which have split bodies at the back (as at present)but also a 'pod' on top so that all three recycling strings can be captured on one visit.

I can't put a timeframe on that just yet though as the technology needs to improve and become more reliable.

I hope that is helpful.

jca111 wrote:
Why thank you Colin, I take my hat off to you. You have changed my opinion of counsellors a bit. You have been honest, admitted mistakes, and provided useful info in a two way dialogue. Ta! I still want weekly collection for my kids nappies, but I guess that's not gonna happen.

Thank you JCA, I was always taught 'sorry' is just a little word but it goes a long way.

I would respectfully ask you to give double bagging whirl with the nappies, as I truly believe you'll find it works (yes I've been a parent).

If not, and I note you're not up for 'Real nappies' drop me or the Council's Helpdesk a line and we'll look see at what other possibilities might exist.

I can't stress strongly enough that this system is an evolving, growing process and even after implementation, further refinements are going to be considered over time.

I've been in this trial for over a year now and I've never had maggotts. i use the free bags the council gives us and i tie up my food waste and use the lockable container supplied which stops those "loveable" foxes who live in mottingham getting to it.

I have a baby, new born i might add, and again no flies/ maggots in my wheelie bin (which yes granted I did pay for myself!). The trial works perfectly well depending on how hygenic you wish to be i guess.

Previously living in Lewisham I did find the supply of a bin useful however, doing the math, (even if the council could get a bin for a quarter of the price of a wheelie bin costing say £40) i reckon that's £3million on bins. I would rather see that better spent on social care or schools if im blatantly honest.

Funny how there's no mention of this on LBB's website!

Bexley have been doing it like this for a longtime. They provide households with the different bins that are needed.....are Bromley going to do this ?

I take my rubbish to Churchfields dump every week. . . . . I notice there is no mention of how much of an increase there has been at borough dumps or fly tipped around the borough.

This will be a complete nightmare for us! We have a 1 year old and if nappies will only be collected fortnightly it will cause us real problems. We already have a problem as we only have a small wheely bin which is shared with the house next door. Almost every week we have to store rubbish bags in the house until collection day as the wheely bin is full. This is despite us being avid recyclers. Our recycle boxes are always full before collection day.

There are a lot of foxes in our neighbourhood and I have even seen magpies and crows making holes in the bags on collection day, picking at the scraps.

I really don't know what we will do. We really don't throw that much food away, it's more the packaging that you can't recycle and of course the nappies!!

Using real nappies isn't an option I would look at as by the time you have washed them all and dried them using a dryer as the weather gets wetter and colder, I don't see that they are any greener than throw away ones!!

I'm really pleased about this - it's been a long time coming. The level of publicity has been rubbish though - I came across this article quite by accident and it seems a big and imminent change!
Just a word in favour of cloth nappies: I used them with both kids, have no tumble drier and found them fantastic. Admittedly most of the ones advertised widely and available in shops like Mothercare are useless, but if you do your research amongst actual cloth users, there are some great, reliable, comfy happiest out there.
Can't wait for the food recycling to start!

Oops -predictive text! That should have said 'nappies', not 'happiest'.

Just to finish off on flies / maggots as promised, it takes 11 days from the eggs hatching to turn back into flies of course...

Of more importance to the maggot stage being the fact they take roughly a week to reach the stage where you open your bin lid and recoil in horror on the odd occasions as I'm sure most of us have at some stage in the past. (this being the point they are 'on the march'looking for somewhere suitable to pupate)

Point I wanted to draw out, but failed dismally on being that given this can happen already in the instance of long bank holidays, missed collections (be it the Council's fault or not putting the bins out)unless you are particularly unlucky and the fly lays the egg at all but the exact moment the waste goes from your dinner plate into the kitchen caddy (with a lid - which comes with a bag to seal it when you subsequently transfer it on to your foodwaste bin outside)it's not likely that they will get into process at that stage, especially if you remember to close the lids on both.

Part of the problem with infestations is that the inside of any given dustbin (past or present) can potentially prove to be a weak link if gunky residues are left in them and the lids are left off, as by the time the next organic waste arrives, the life cycle process is already at a further advanced stage.

Hope that make a bit more sense...

Cllr Colin Smith wrote:
Nothing's changed JCA. The headline is extremely unhelpful in it's use of the word "Fortnightly" which the new system emphatically isn't. On average you used to get 4 collections every two weeks, under the arrangements you get 6. All you have to do differently is put foodstuffs, chicken carcases and anything else which might potentially smell in a different (airtight, lockable, rodent proof) box, which is still collected weekly. Have a look at the Council's website in respect of nappies and it will give you a range of options if you have an aversion to double bagging them (which I have to say seems to work well enough for most people) Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear. Whether you've got a big garden or small (mine's a medium sized semi for what it's worth, but my mother-in-law's who has been in the trial area's is a tiny terraced one) if the waste is presented properly, there is no reason at all why flies will appear. But don't take my word for it, ask those already using the system. It comes recommended with a truly amazing 74% for, 7% against approval rating. Thake a quantum leap of faith, the cup is half full.

My council tax is over £2000 per year. I want weekly waste collections. I don't want a managed waste area at my home, nor do I want compost in my garden. I have been on this scheme for over a year, maybe 18 months. I refuse to use the black box. Everything goes in a bin bag. If you start charging us by weight, I'll burn it, which is worse. The council will not dictate to me how I will dispose of my rubbish when my tax is so high.
No one I know likes the scheme. Your 74% for is a massaged figure. If you came to my area it'd be 0% in favor. Its lies and spin and all we can expect from public officers.
You server the public of Bromley. Its about time YOU started to listen to us. The general message on here is that the public you serve don't want by weekly collections and the new government has proposed banning bi-weekly collections as its something that the public are passionate about.
Why don't you make a name for yourself in Bromley and give the people what they want?
Maybe its time to get your expenses under the freedon of information act and see if you've been minding public money with the same attitude? The attitude that you are right and the people who you serve are wrong?

Ask a council tax payer what they want in return for their payments and they will say, "To get my rubbish collected". No slipping and sliding about, trying to put a spin on things by saying "nothing's changed". We're not stupid! Saving "millions of pounds over future years" is not the issue: if we wanted to do that we could do any number of things including not paying Bromley councillors the best part of £1,000,000 each year and slashing the number of councillors from 60 to around 22. Saving money is not the issue, it's about providing a public service. Recycling is to be encouraged and applauded but not at the expense of a weekly rubbish collection which you pay for and which you should expect. You are the tax payer, you are the people paying the councillors who make these decisions and you are the people who vote in these councillors who make these decisions. More than ever we need independent representation on Bromley Council as happens in councils all around the country. In Bromley we have none. But we won't forget what the councillors are doing to our rubbish collections. In May 2014 you must stand in the council elections as an Independent, putting the taxpayer first. It may be four years away but when the time comes we will remind the Bromley council tax payer what their elected representatives did in 2010. John Hemming-Clark, Independent candidate

I was concerned and saddened to read some of the comments, especially those from ho_ho_ho and John Hemming-Clark (who seems to be using this to push a political agenda). Surely we cannot simply keep dumping our waste into the ground, so recyling is essential.
What property has a council tax over £2000 - is it one where the residents expect everything to be done for them?
And do councillors get paid over £1m a year?

Although I'm miffed about the 2 weekly instead of weekly, I'm looking forward to the recycling service. I compost now but this facility will mean I can get rid of a lot more kitchen waste in an environmentally friendly way....good news.
The council will need to 'up their game' however in their efficiency of collecting otherwise the streets will be paved with recycling.
I'm happy to do my end of the deal and suffer fortnightly collections if they stick to their end ... collecting when they say they will, providing extra bins if needed, taking more care when collecting and picking up anything that they drop etc etc.

I am also in the trial area and we have never had any problems, it only takes seconds to seperate waste & put into paper / bottles & cans / food waste, rather than one bin. Because of the amount we now recyle even if the "ordinary" waste was only collected once a month I doubt we would have filled the bin - just shows how much can be recycled. We needed another bin for bottles & cans - it was delivered quickly.
And we have never had problems with the collections, if anything is dropped they always pick it up

ho_ho_ho wrote:

Cllr Colin Smith wrote:
Nothing's changed JCA. The headline is extremely unhelpful in it's use of the word "Fortnightly" which the new system emphatically isn't. On average you used to get 4 collections every two weeks, under the arrangements you get 6. All you have to do differently is put foodstuffs, chicken carcases and anything else which might potentially smell in a different (airtight, lockable, rodent proof) box, which is still collected weekly. Have a look at the Council's website in respect of nappies and it will give you a range of options if you have an aversion to double bagging them (which I have to say seems to work well enough for most people) Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear. Whether you've got a big garden or small (mine's a medium sized semi for what it's worth, but my mother-in-law's who has been in the trial area's is a tiny terraced one) if the waste is presented properly, there is no reason at all why flies will appear. But don't take my word for it, ask those already using the system. It comes recommended with a truly amazing 74% for, 7% against approval rating. Thake a quantum leap of faith, the cup is half full.

My council tax is over £2000 per year. I want weekly waste collections. I don't want a managed waste area at my home, nor do I want compost in my garden. I have been on this scheme for over a year, maybe 18 months. I refuse to use the black box. Everything goes in a bin bag. If you start charging us by weight, I'll burn it, which is worse. The council will not dictate to me how I will dispose of my rubbish when my tax is so high.
No one I know likes the scheme. Your 74% for is a massaged figure. If you came to my area it'd be 0% in favor. Its lies and spin and all we can expect from public officers.
You server the public of Bromley. Its about time YOU started to listen to us. The general message on here is that the public you serve don't want by weekly collections and the new government has proposed banning bi-weekly collections as its something that the public are passionate about.
Why don't you make a name for yourself in Bromley and give the people what they want?
Maybe its time to get your expenses under the freedon of information act and see if you've been minding public money with the same attitude? The attitude that you are right and the people who you serve are wrong?

Well you really are just a selfish idiot then.

I still want weekly collections, but I do my bit as much as possible.

But your attitude makes me sick. Me, Me Me. Stuff anyone else - I want it easy.

You lazy fool. People like you are the reason some councils are talking about fining people you do NO recycling.

3 cheers for Councillor Colin Smith.
As far as I can tell this is a great scheme, and the Councillor should be congratulated on his efforts.
Was any thought given to giving a Council Tax rebate to those households that recycle properly? Irresponsible (and anonymous) people like Ho Ho Ho should be charged more for their deliberate and costly behaviour. People like them cost those of us that do the right thing more. It follows in my logic that they should be charged more and we should be charged less.

For those of you who are interested and live in the area, Tesco's at Elmers End have bins for recycling tetrapak cartons - they are near the ramp to the upper car deck. If not near there try a supermarket near you.

I agree - Cllr Smith, can we please see your expenses submissions before you criticise us and our opinions on the rubbish collections. As predicted you have made nothing but excuses when asked questions about bigger bins etc - "mesh covering" - what good is that?!!! "Get more boxes" - well I would if Bromley Council listened to my requests to deliver them! "Compost bins are coming" - bit too late - I had to buy my own one as I waited so long - can I expense this to Bromley council and take it off my council tax?

I expect nothing less from a Conservative council.....and a predominantly white middle class borough - as long as the posh Chislets and Bromlets are ok.....

Cllr Colin Smith, ive got an idea. Say to all the people who are moaning about rubbish collection that if they are not happy about their rubbish collections, recycling facilities then they will pay £30 a month less in council tax and not have any of their rubbish collected. It will then be their responsibility to recycle it/sort it, bag it in clear bags and then take it to the tip. At the tip they will then have to show the tip guys that each bag has been recyled correctly and then they have to take their own waste to the correct bin and dump it. See how long it takes for them to stop moaning...

How about sending all those people identified by the government as living off benefits as a 'life choice', down to the tips to sort through our rubbish for us. That way the hard working tax and rate payers wouldn't have to spend their well deserved time off doing it while they sit on their backsides watching Sky TV.

I have lived at various addresses in Bromley for past 50+ years and never had any problems with refuge collection. Those I hear moaning usually treat the refuge collectors like dirt - moaning if they're late, complaining etc.
If ho ho ho doesn't like it why not move to another borough & see if things are better (I doubt it) or as above, give him a rebate & let him take all his waste to a tip.
I have always voted for the other party but, much though it pains me to say, the consevatives do a good job in Bromley

we've had this system for a while now and broadly speaking it works. but:

- you do have a multitude of containers to collect / store and they take up room

- whatever you say, the nappy bags do smell and even with a separate bin with a decent lid this attracts flies

overall, the bin men here do a great job - and i support this for the reduction in landfill

if only there was a way to reduce the number of containers though!

jca111 wrote:

ho_ho_ho wrote:

Cllr Colin Smith wrote: Nothing's changed JCA. The headline is extremely unhelpful in it's use of the word "Fortnightly" which the new system emphatically isn't. On average you used to get 4 collections every two weeks, under the arrangements you get 6. All you have to do differently is put foodstuffs, chicken carcases and anything else which might potentially smell in a different (airtight, lockable, rodent proof) box, which is still collected weekly. Have a look at the Council's website in respect of nappies and it will give you a range of options if you have an aversion to double bagging them (which I have to say seems to work well enough for most people) Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear. Whether you've got a big garden or small (mine's a medium sized semi for what it's worth, but my mother-in-law's who has been in the trial area's is a tiny terraced one) if the waste is presented properly, there is no reason at all why flies will appear. But don't take my word for it, ask those already using the system. It comes recommended with a truly amazing 74% for, 7% against approval rating. Thake a quantum leap of faith, the cup is half full.

My council tax is over £2000 per year. I want weekly waste collections. I don't want a managed waste area at my home, nor do I want compost in my garden. I have been on this scheme for over a year, maybe 18 months. I refuse to use the black box. Everything goes in a bin bag. If you start charging us by weight, I'll burn it, which is worse. The council will not dictate to me how I will dispose of my rubbish when my tax is so high. No one I know likes the scheme. Your 74% for is a massaged figure. If you came to my area it'd be 0% in favor. Its lies and spin and all we can expect from public officers. You server the public of Bromley. Its about time YOU started to listen to us. The general message on here is that the public you serve don't want by weekly collections and the new government has proposed banning bi-weekly collections as its something that the public are passionate about. Why don't you make a name for yourself in Bromley and give the people what they want? Maybe its time to get your expenses under the freedon of information act and see if you've been minding public money with the same attitude? The attitude that you are right and the people who you serve are wrong?

Well you really are just a selfish idiot then. I still want weekly collections, but I do my bit as much as possible. But your attitude makes me sick. Me, Me Me. Stuff anyone else - I want it easy. You lazy fool. People like you are the reason some councils are talking about fining people you do NO recycling.

Yep, thats right. I don't care about you or anyone. My life is about me, my family and friends. I'm not a socialist. I contribute huge taxes. Thats my part and I begrudge every penny of it. The money is wasted by fools like this counciler on divvy policy's to justify their pointless existance. Every time I hear there are more public job cuts, I smile.
You call me lazy. I work 16hrs a day 6 days a week. Thats not lazy. Your choice of words are incorrect. Insulting someone and accusing them of idiocy because their environmental compass points in a different direction to yours imbecilic.

&

Reasonable 75, the answer is a nice big one.
.
.
John Hemming-Clark, Independent candidate. You have my vote.

We need another Thatcher to sort this place out.

Pigeon78 wrote:
In light of this news, I plan on starting a petition or if anyone else is interested in collaborating and starting one. I live on the cusp of Bromley and Greenwich council yet, unfortunately come under Bromley borough. Greenwich council residents are provided with FREE wheely bins and large ones at that for all kinds of waste. I have had to buy my own rubbish bin, put up with tiny little recycling bins which end up overflowing (as clearly I am recycling well) and had to buy my own compost bin (perhaps I should send the receipt to BC).....anyway, if Greenwich council can manage it, then why can't Bromley? I am sick of all these excuses and it's about time someone stood up and did something constructive instead of moaning in the usual English way and then accepting it.

Nothing is FREE pigeon. Everything is a function of Council Tax.

Whilst I wouldn't dream of criticizing another Borough's efforts in dealing with this tricky problem,I don't think it's unreasonable to point out that despite having 70,000 fewer residents than Bromley, Greenwich also receives approx £125millon more each year than Bromley in Council Tax support under the previous Government's Rate support Grant methodology.

(For those who don't know @65/75% of local Council spend is Government funded, the rest is raised in Council Tax)

Whether that's fair or unfair is a matter of opinion, but what isn't,is that having £125million extra to spend every year provides anyone with a lot more options.

That said, even if we had a few extra million pounds laying around looking for a home, I would much rather see it spent on things like school maintenance, road repairs and care for the elderly.

It's easy to sit on the sidelines criticizing, less so making the tough decisions that are needed to keep the wheels turning without jacking up Council Tax to every higher levels.

I would be very interested to learn more about any service failings you might have in mind, should you wish to forward them to me for investigation.

fpercy wrote:
This will be a complete nightmare for us! We have a 1 year old and if nappies will only be collected fortnightly it will cause us real problems. We already have a problem as we only have a small wheely bin which is shared with the house next door. Almost every week we have to store rubbish bags in the house until collection day as the wheely bin is full. This is despite us being avid recyclers. Our recycle boxes are always full before collection day. There are a lot of foxes in our neighbourhood and I have even seen magpies and crows making holes in the bags on collection day, picking at the scraps. I really don't know what we will do. We really don't throw that much food away, it's more the packaging that you can't recycle and of course the nappies!! Using real nappies isn't an option I would look at as by the time you have washed them all and dried them using a dryer as the weather gets wetter and colder, I don't see that they are any greener than throw away ones!!

Fpercy,

You will be receiving further information on this programme over coming weeks.

Give one of the Counil's waste advisors a call on the number provided and they be very happy to pay you a visit to assess your circumstances and offer advice.

'Mickey boy' up string (the'quote' button isn't working).

Re the website, no it's not really funny, the decision has only recently been taken and it's still being updated.

'It's me Again'. You will be supplied with a kitchen caddy to transfer your waste from the kitchen to your food recycling bin (which is also supplied).

You can also have an extra green bin should you need one.

Cllr Colin Smith,

Firstly I would like to say well done for getting on here and making your point and not hiding in your office hoping that things would go away. I havent lived in the area for a while now but when I did I didnt see much wrong with the area. Yeah, there were a few holes in the road, street lights not working etc but if the public dont let you guys know then what can you do? People that live in Bromley, or any area to be honest, need to start doing things themselves rather then relying on other people. I know for a fact that things werent right in my mums street so she made a note of whats wrong, rang Bromley Council and in just over a week things were sorted and fine.

I won't name check you all individually but thank you to all those above who have adopted such a positive approach,
your faith is well placed and you won't be disappointed.

Working on through the questions

Mr2wheelsup... flytipping has actually been edging lower in recent years but it's obviously something we continue to monitor closely.

Alsy.. I personally make you right about real nappies, and the Council does promote them as a possible option, but we're not prescriptive or preachy on the subject because we know different people hold totally different views on the subject.

Disposables don't come cheap to buy
(or dispose of) either.

ho_ho_ho wrote:

Cllr Colin Smith wrote: Nothing's changed JCA. The headline is extremely unhelpful in it's use of the word "Fortnightly" which the new system emphatically isn't. On average you used to get 4 collections every two weeks, under the arrangements you get 6. All you have to do differently is put foodstuffs, chicken carcases and anything else which might potentially smell in a different (airtight, lockable, rodent proof) box, which is still collected weekly. Have a look at the Council's website in respect of nappies and it will give you a range of options if you have an aversion to double bagging them (which I have to say seems to work well enough for most people) Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear. Whether you've got a big garden or small (mine's a medium sized semi for what it's worth, but my mother-in-law's who has been in the trial area's is a tiny terraced one) if the waste is presented properly, there is no reason at all why flies will appear. But don't take my word for it, ask those already using the system. It comes recommended with a truly amazing 74% for, 7% against approval rating. Thake a quantum leap of faith, the cup is half full.

My council tax is over £2000 per year. I want weekly waste collections. I don't want a managed waste area at my home, nor do I want compost in my garden. I have been on this scheme for over a year, maybe 18 months. I refuse to use the black box. Everything goes in a bin bag. If you start charging us by weight, I'll burn it, which is worse. The council will not dictate to me how I will dispose of my rubbish when my tax is so high. No one I know likes the scheme. Your 74% for is a massaged figure. If you came to my area it'd be 0% in favor. Its lies and spin and all we can expect from public officers. You server the public of Bromley. Its about time YOU started to listen to us. The general message on here is that the public you serve don't want by weekly collections and the new government has proposed banning bi-weekly collections as its something that the public are passionate about. Why don't you make a name for yourself in Bromley and give the people what they want? Maybe its time to get your expenses under the freedon of information act and see if you've been minding public money with the same attitude? The attitude that you are right and the people who you serve are wrong?

You must be the world's most miserable Santa Claus ever Ho_ho_ho.

More like the Grinch that stole it if truth be told

Where to begin...

However much you pay in Council Tax now is irrelevant. You will be paying even more than you are already if we don't recycle more (fact, not opinion)

You do (still) get weekly collections under the new system, you get 3 a week rather than 4 over two weeks until the old arrangements.

I don't think many of us "want" to have to do eevrything that's being asked but that's rather missing the point that 'doing nothing' isn't an option.

Willfully refusing to recycle paper is pretty childish and socially irresponsible in my view, but if that's the way you want to live your life and you feel good about it, fair play. Don't complain when your Council tax next goes up either.

74% isn't a massaged figure either (though it should 72%) and if you think it's " a lie" let me have you email address and I'll put you in touch with the Independant Market Reaseach company 'Snap', who undertook it for us. I'm sure their corporate lawyer will be happy to put you right.

For those that are interested and have an open mind, other headline questions and response rates are :

It's good that Bromley Council are taking recycling this serious 94% agree 2% don't

Composting is a much better alternative than burying waste in landfill sites 94% agree 1% don't

By doing this Bromley Council are doing something positive for the environment 90% agree 2 % don't

This has to be the future for dealing with Household Waste 83% agree 5% didn't

It's just too inconvenient to separate out kitchen waste 9% agreed 79% don't

I really like the new service 72% agree 7% don't

Some spin !

If anyone would like a copy of the survey, please drop me a line and I'll sent you the adobe file. It may or may
not have been uploaded onto the Council's website yet.

Coming back to Ho Ho Ho, you will be pleased to hear that there are no plans to charge you by weight, so there's no nee to get yourself in a lather over bonfires.

As for listening, I've given you the facts of the matter, where are yours?

As for expenses, let me save you the trouble of asking an FOI and wasting Council Tax payers money needlessly, for memory the total some £28 (for travelling up to London on Council business)

If you mean "allowances" they can be downloaded from the Council website.

John Hemming-Clark wrote:
Ask a council tax payer what they want in return for their payments and they will say, "To get my rubbish collected". No slipping and sliding about, trying to put a spin on things by saying "nothing's changed". We're not stupid! Saving "millions of pounds over future years" is not the issue: if we wanted to do that we could do any number of things including not paying Bromley councillors the best part of £1,000,000 each year and slashing the number of councillors from 60 to around 22. Saving money is not the issue, it's about providing a public service. Recycling is to be encouraged and applauded but not at the expense of a weekly rubbish collection which you pay for and which you should expect. You are the tax payer, you are the people paying the councillors who make these decisions and you are the people who vote in these councillors who make these decisions. More than ever we need independent representation on Bromley Council as happens in councils all around the country. In Bromley we have none. But we won't forget what the councillors are doing to our rubbish collections. In May 2014 you must stand in the council elections as an Independent, putting the taxpayer first. It may be four years away but when the time comes we will remind the Bromley council tax payer what their elected representatives did in 2010. John Hemming-Clark, Independent candidate

John, bless.

Have you ever let a bandwagon pass without jumping on it ?

Come and stand against me next time.

I'll be very happy to take you on.

HayesMum wrote:
Although I'm miffed about the 2 weekly instead of weekly, I'm looking forward to the recycling service. I compost now but this facility will mean I can get rid of a lot more kitchen waste in an environmentally friendly way....good news. The council will need to 'up their game' however in their efficiency of collecting otherwise the streets will be paved with recycling. I'm happy to do my end of the deal and suffer fortnightly collections if they stick to their end ... collecting when they say they will, providing extra bins if needed, taking more care when collecting and picking up anything that they drop etc etc.

Hayes Mum ....

Sorry, but thank you for being so practical.It really is a case of needs must I'm afraid.

Not only is the cost prohibitive, left with the option of either using the foodwaste bin or not, a good number won't bother knowing that the waste will be removed anyway.

This model drives the food recycling out in such cases.

Julian Winnfield

Thank you for the kind words.

You are right of course, individuals like HHH and oportunists like Mr Hemming Clark, do cost the rest of us (and themselves) money if listened to.

The Council tax rebate question is an interesting one. It's implicitly already happening by helping us avoid future increases (if that makes sense).

Sadly it's a broad brush and those named above benefit from this as well,
but it helps to keep everything simple and operating costs to the barest minimum possible.

Where households are seen not to be recycling, they are contacted by the Council's waste advisors team to see whether there's a problem and encouraged to 'sign up'. Most then do so.

The Council does have powers to fine people as a last resort, but we try very hard to get where we want to be by education and convincing people, rather than waving a big stick.

In extremis though, if anyone is seen to be deliberately flouting the service,
and ignores repeat reasonable requests and advice to stop, that could happen.

Pigeon78 wrote:
I agree - Cllr Smith, can we please see your expenses submissions before you criticise us and our opinions on the rubbish collections. As predicted you have made nothing but excuses when asked questions about bigger bins etc - "mesh covering" - what good is that?!!! "Get more boxes" - well I would if Bromley Council listened to my requests to deliver them! "Compost bins are coming" - bit too late - I had to buy my own one as I waited so long - can I expense this to Bromley council and take it off my council tax? I expect nothing less from a Conservative council.....and a predominantly white middle class borough - as long as the posh Chislets and Bromlets are ok.....

I've answered the question about 'expenses' upstring.

I'm happy to allow others to decide whether I'm "making excuses" or setting out the facts as accurately as I can.

Your complaint about 'poor service' has been addressed as well, let me have some facts and I will investigate them for you.

No, you obviously can't invoice the cost of your compost bin to the Council.

Your find paragraph is your opinion. In my view it's a very silly comment.

Make Life, In your heart .... LOL

Would be nice in a way wouldn't it, though in fairness people do have every right to express their opinions as they are. It would be a boring world if we all agreed on everything.

As our cheery chum Ho_ho_ho and Mr2wheels have alluded though, it wouldn't work in practice as the sad
minority living in our midst would revert to fly-tipping and bonfires.

Stinker,

We're trying !

http://www.bromley.g
ov.uk/News/newsarchi
ve2010/Mar2010/Payba
ck+punishes+offender
s+and+boosts+Bromley
s+recycling.htm

Anyone thought about the use of lots water to wash all this recycling out?? You have to pay for composting bins from council. We have tonnes of garden refuse of which masses are from council owned trees!!! We compost and recycle just about everything we can. Getting bored with it all now. Maggots DO occasionally thrive in dustbins even when collected weekly. Despite washing bin out!!!

Cllr Colin Smith wrote:

ho_ho_ho wrote:

Cllr Colin Smith wrote: Nothing's changed JCA. The headline is extremely unhelpful in it's use of the word "Fortnightly" which the new system emphatically isn't. On average you used to get 4 collections every two weeks, under the arrangements you get 6. All you have to do differently is put foodstuffs, chicken carcases and anything else which might potentially smell in a different (airtight, lockable, rodent proof) box, which is still collected weekly. Have a look at the Council's website in respect of nappies and it will give you a range of options if you have an aversion to double bagging them (which I have to say seems to work well enough for most people) Flys eggs take 11 days to hatch into maggots so providing you put food waste in the food waste bin and observe basic hygiene by swishing your bin out with disinfectant periodically there's no reason at all why they should appear. Whether you've got a big garden or small (mine's a medium sized semi for what it's worth, but my mother-in-law's who has been in the trial area's is a tiny terraced one) if the waste is presented properly, there is no reason at all why flies will appear. But don't take my word for it, ask those already using the system. It comes recommended with a truly amazing 74% for, 7% against approval rating. Thake a quantum leap of faith, the cup is half full.

My council tax is over £2000 per year. I want weekly waste collections. I don't want a managed waste area at my home, nor do I want compost in my garden. I have been on this scheme for over a year, maybe 18 months. I refuse to use the black box. Everything goes in a bin bag. If you start charging us by weight, I'll burn it, which is worse. The council will not dictate to me how I will dispose of my rubbish when my tax is so high. No one I know likes the scheme. Your 74% for is a massaged figure. If you came to my area it'd be 0% in favor. Its lies and spin and all we can expect from public officers. You server the public of Bromley. Its about time YOU started to listen to us. The general message on here is that the public you serve don't want by weekly collections and the new government has proposed banning bi-weekly collections as its something that the public are passionate about. Why don't you make a name for yourself in Bromley and give the people what they want? Maybe its time to get your expenses under the freedon of information act and see if you've been minding public money with the same attitude? The attitude that you are right and the people who you serve are wrong?

You must be the world's most miserable Santa Claus ever Ho_ho_ho. More like the Grinch that stole it if truth be told Where to begin... However much you pay in Council Tax now is irrelevant. You will be paying even more than you are already if we don't recycle more (fact, not opinion) You do (still) get weekly collections under the new system, you get 3 a week rather than 4 over two weeks until the old arrangements. I don't think many of us "want" to have to do eevrything that's being asked but that's rather missing the point that 'doing nothing' isn't an option. Willfully refusing to recycle paper is pretty childish and socially irresponsible in my view, but if that's the way you want to live your life and you feel good about it, fair play. Don't complain when your Council tax next goes up either. 74% isn't a massaged figure either (though it should 72%) and if you think it's " a lie" let me have you email address and I'll put you in touch with the Independant Market Reaseach company 'Snap', who undertook it for us. I'm sure their corporate lawyer will be happy to put you right. For those that are interested and have an open mind, other headline questions and response rates are : It's good that Bromley Council are taking recycling this serious 94% agree 2% don't Composting is a much better alternative than burying waste in landfill sites 94% agree 1% don't By doing this Bromley Council are doing something positive for the environment 90% agree 2 % don't This has to be the future for dealing with Household Waste 83% agree 5% didn't It's just too inconvenient to separate out kitchen waste 9% agreed 79% don't I really like the new service 72% agree 7% don't Some spin ! If anyone would like a copy of the survey, please drop me a line and I'll sent you the adobe file. It may or may not have been uploaded onto the Council's website yet. Coming back to Ho Ho Ho, you will be pleased to hear that there are no plans to charge you by weight, so there's no nee to get yourself in a lather over bonfires. As for listening, I've given you the facts of the matter, where are yours? As for expenses, let me save you the trouble of asking an FOI and wasting Council Tax payers money needlessly, for memory the total some £28 (for travelling up to London on Council business) If you mean "allowances" they can be downloaded from the Council website.

Colin, allow me to retort. Being sarcastic magnifies your ignorance. Quite simpley put. Land fill costs more because land fill tax is raised year on year. Its just another way to collect money. The FACT that you don't communicate is that IF the wholesale cost of recycled substances is higher than land fill. It goes to land fill, because in the end the government is a large business. Thats why I lothe you and your systems. You shout about recycling and only recycle in the end if the numbers stack up. Lies lies lies. All we expect from public office.

Ho ho ho.
You claim to live in a big house and pay a great deal in tax. You claim to work sixteen hours a day, six days a week.
How can someone who is as 'successful' as you get away with such poor spelling and grammar?
For the record, the word 'simpley' is spelt 'simply' and the word 'lothe' is spelt 'loathe'.

Councillor Smith.
Well done for responding to all the comments here. You are a breath of fresh air.

Julian Winnfield

Hello, your friendly UKIP election candidate here. I'm sorry I've seen this late. But what does not seem to have been mentioned here is that what is actually being implemented here is a scheme to help save the council money that they are being charged, as a tax, to dump your waste. The reason they need to do this is down to the EU's 2002 Landfill Directive which had a time-limit of up to June 2009 to be implemented. This is another daft crazy idea being pushed by the EU while they pretend to be encouraging recycling. Really this is about money and power - more of both for the EU Commission. The significant effect is not better and more efficient recycling but the foolish implementation of a policy which is very inconvenient and expensive for the citizens of this country.

The particular issue with the policy is the fact that the EU is charging councils a Landfill tax. The tax doubled since 2007 (to £48 per ton) and is going to increase further to £80.00 per ton by 2014 making it extremely expensive for councils to dump your rubbish.

We are the losers here. The same money could be spent (actually, probably a lot less) implementing a proper recycling policy, retaining weekly bin collections and removing the restrictions on dumping waste at Waldo Road waste disposal site (so you can dump your DIY waste without additional charge) It is a real shame that the UK blindly implements these ill-conceived EU issued directives that are so damaging to our country and the wellbeing of its citizens.
The new Tory / Lib-Dem government is powerless to prevent this from happening as their policy of total compliance with every new EU directive means there is no bright future for this country. The Labour government were in much the same position blindly following orders from the EU Commission. If you keep voting for the three old failed parties then things like this are going to continue happening. They have had to increase council tax to be able to pay the EU landfill tax and at the same time they are forced to provide less service in return for that money. Don't believe it when they dress this change up as progress. It is regressive and it can't be stopped. UKIP would return to weekly bin collections and implement a decent and efficient recycling policy that worked without costing or inconveniencing ordinary folk like you and I.