My heart goes out the family for there lose.

BUt FFS this has got to stop

Trident yet again anyone see a trend in all these stabbings and gun killings

Another murder within a couple of miles of myself... Is there any stop to this? The victim is also the 21st teenager to die in Greater London as a result of knife and gun crime. Surely this problem needs resolving as it's a pretty big thing now and nothing seems to be stopping these people from commiting murder or assault with knives and guns!

this is the 5th incident i have heard since friday what is this place coming to.something has to be done sooner rather than later,to many lives are being taken .......for what.

Poor lad. RIP. To be honest I have lost count of how many youths lives have been lost this year in London, due to stabbings and shootings. My sister is 14 and my cousin is 6, and I don't want them growing up with this violence all around them. It has got to stop NOW!

Worrying thing is

The stabbing in Ampleforth Rd last week never made the headlines, strangly and the shooting in Kale Rd Thamesmead last Thursday did not make it on here

Dear Mr G.Brown, it's good to see that you have your priorites right. Tax everyone up to the eyelids and turn a blind eye to all the innocent people that are being knifed and shot at the moment. Thanks very much. A citizen of crime ridden London.

Des,

Was the Kale Rd incident a stabbing rather than a shooting? If so we've reported on that one quite extensively over the past few days.

The other incident you mentioned isn't immediately familiar to me but then if it was a serious stabbing and was one we were told about by the police then I'm sure we would have done something. If you can give me a few more details on that one, I can look into it.

Me wrote:
Dear Mr G.Brown, it's good to see that you have your priorites right. Tax everyone up to the eyelids and turn a blind eye to all the innocent people that are being knifed and shot at the moment. Thanks very much. A citizen of crime ridden London.

I don't think some of these people being murdered are exactly 'innocent'. They obviously have mixed with people they shouldn't have to get themselves in the situation where they're being murdered. The one in Thamesmead and the Woman in New Cross where innocent victims, but these teenagers being murdered are most likely involved in Drugs and other dodgy dealings.

I left Plumstead 6 years ago; before this 'explosion' in knives, guns and murders.

Back then, it seemed things were getting worse and I wondered what would happen if it was not sorted out.

It seems we are begining to learn the answer.

Please God, I hope someone does something soon, otherwise I am scared to think what it will be like in another 5 years.

My thoughts go out to the families and friends of the victims.

I would also like to thank the News Shopper for reporting these stories and keeping us informed.

It seems to be happening more often than not now and is getting way out of hand. It is now becoming a fact that the youths of this country are running it. Even if they were mixing in the wrong crowd it does not deserve for someone to be shot, stabbed, murdered or any of the above. All the money being spent on regenerating Woolwich will be a complete waste if we don't start controlling the children of today - because thats what they are kids no more than that. My thoughts go out to the boys family and for every other person who seems to be losing someone in such tragic circumstances.

the police in the area do nothing they would rather investigate to the max on the minor crimes as they dont want to get there hands dirty, its only going to get worse. I dread to think what it is going to be like when i eventually have kids, im 19 and i already have 4 friends dead! something needs to be done!

"Controlling the children of today" is exactly the point here. The softly softly approach the courts take to those under 18 has got to stop. These people need to be punished properly the first time they hav dealings with the type of drugs this sort of incident tends to be over, before they can become killers.

The parents need to get a grip also. If they cant control their offspring then the state needs to revue exactly what financial and housing suport it gives these wayward parents. After all, you can bet its not hard working families that are breeding this evil breed of teenager.

According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

** wrote:
the police in the area do nothing they would rather investigate to the max on the minor crimes as they dont want to get there hands dirty, its only going to get worse. I dread to think what it is going to be like when i eventually have kids, im 19 and i already have 4 friends dead! something needs to be done!

**, dont you see - these people commit minor crime too. The police might stop a 'dodgy looking motor' because the car has got a brakelight out, and you may see it as a 'waste of time' or a 'minor crime' - whats to say thats not the car containing the gun that killed this boy. Im sure if these people are not bothered about killing people they're not going to be too worried about more minor breaches to law and order?

Also, when me and my mates were teenagers we still had to be accountable as to where we were going to our parents. Take a look around woolwich town centre and then tell me that the parents of the youngsters you see know where they are? Youll think this sounds stupid, but that is exactly the attitude that has got us where we are today.

The police should stop picking on innocent people when it comes to stop and searches.
They should concerntrate on the people carrying guns and knives, they know who these people are but are too scared to search them. They should be given more power and the people carrying the weapons should get 5 years straight away.
Woolwich and plumstead might be getting regenerated but it wont get rid of the scum.

Anon, I cant imagine that the police being too scared is the case, at least, that is what I am told by someone I know who works for the police in Lewisham. I suggest the police are not mind readers and dont have crystal balls to work out who has a weapon and who doesnt. I guess the police do know who has had a weapon before, but if they ONLY go looking for those people they wont get the first timers and people who they havn't seen with a knife/gun before. The police need to go out there with an open mind and stop anyone who is known for crime and also anyone looking suspicious - white/black/yellow whatever race. If inncoent people get stopped then so beit - if I got stopped by the police i would feel reassured that the polce are doing something and are being proactive to sort this mess.

We need more police on our streets to find these people. That will help this problem - I heard the other day that police officers are being transferred into a poice call centres. How does that help this problem?

cant beleive its happend agen gang related people are killing eachother and they dont even care all they are worried about is there pried with there boys its not right its got to stop my heart goes out to them 2 boys and there family r.i.p to that one booy xx i just wish that people would come to there sences and stop gun and knife crime

The W.C.E WOOLWICH COMMON ESTATE ,is where this incident took place , I used to deliver local papers on Long Walk SE18. The police is the metropolitan police in this case and they are not any good with communicating with the general public in our metropolitan area. The most that may come of this is a few houses being raided in the woolwich common estate area. This is a black on black crime and I do not think the metropolitan police with the reputation the force has should deal with black on black crimes or race related crimes.

Darren, Erith - I don't quite follow your thinking...who, if not the Met, should investigate this? Or it just shouldn't be investigated? I think you're alluding to the Met having a reputation for being racist - I think that's rather unjust nowadays.

The Metropolitan police is an Institutionalised racist police force , it has been investigated and given that title because of the Stephen Lawrence enquiry. I do not need to elude anyone about the racism within the metropolitan police force.
This crime has no choice but to be investigated by the Met police but if Kent police were to handle it for example , the public would have more faith in a conviction.

Considering things like this are a regular occurance in Greater London the MET Police in my opinion are more qualified and more likely to find the culprit than the Kent police who mainly deal in petty crime.

In this day and age do you really think the police would bring race into the matter in regards to dealing with the crime at hand? If they wasn't bothered about solving crimes involving the ethnic minority then they wouldn't have a dedicated section who deal with Black on black crime.

Why do people have to use knives and guns all the time. there has been 53 peopel under the age of 20 to be murdered since the beging of the year

the person killed was not from the area and the killers are not local people or local gang. one more thing, the person killed has ...... before. RIP

Trident was formed upon instructions from the Independant Advisory commitee. Trident in my opinion says that gun crime is a black persons crime which in fact is not true , its a social problem. If you are a member of society , you could be affected.
Regular occurance is an understatement at this time and Trident are not doing much to stop gun crime or the causes of gun crime.
Trident is only 370 strong in manpower.
Hardly a force to be reckoned with...

INFO wrote:
the person killed was not from the area and the killers are not local people or local gang. one more thing, the person killed has ...... before. RIP

Any how do you know all this ? The mind boggles !

Ive got two sons that have been mugged by knife point. one last month in Godstow Road Abbey Wood and one today at the Abbey Ruins and both times its been black youths.

lorrie...have you reported these crimes to the police and got crime numbers for each attack?

Anon wrote:

INFO wrote:
the person killed was not from the area and the killers are not local people or local gang. one more thing, the person killed has ...... before. RIP

Any how do you know all this ? The mind boggles !

It was quoted on London Tonight that the crime has something to do with gangs from Thamesmead (T-Block) and Charlton (Cherry Orchard) having fueds with a gang from Woolwich (Woolwich boys). Whether or not this is the truth is another matter.

BTW it didn't quote the gang names on London tonight it's just common knowledge that these are the gangs in question.

lorrie, Abbey wood wrote:
Ive got two sons that have been mugged by knife point. one last month in Godstow Road Abbey Wood and one today at the Abbey Ruins and both times its been black youths.

And your point is what Lorrie ? Your sons say to you that they got mugged by two black guys. I hope they told the police and its being investigated.
A lot of blame is put upon black youths innocent or not, its known in Abbey Wood , Belvedere , Erith , Slade Green to blame black people for their crimes.

ben.a resident said there had been trouble in the past from thamesmead charlton and woolwich but they didn't say they had anything to do with this.

Lets start addressing this issue and open it up. What if we stop looking to blame and concentrate on stopping violent crime. A weapons amnesty should be launched at all metropolitan police stations and other police forces can join in. Hand in all your weapons and no questions asked, no criminal record or even a caution. Thats just a start....Theres a saying , "the devil makes use of idle hands" If you like guns you can be kept busy learning about weapons in the armed forces as well as earn a salary. I do feel that for Britain as a society and England as a country this problem can be solved and by doing so we can show the rest of the world how to start combating gun crime.

carrie wrote:
ben.a resident said there had been trouble in the past from thamesmead charlton and woolwich but they didn't say they had anything to do with this.

I think your right, but it's almost definately gang related - I mean people usually have these guns to protect themselves against other gangs or dispose of rival members in what can almost be called assisination in cases like this. There is alot of gang activity in Woolwich so it wouldn't surprise me in the least if it had something to do with any of the known gangs.

ben..most people dont carry a gun around so youre probably right but they said on itv that the victim is not from the local area.

Des wrote:
Worrying thing is The stabbing in Ampleforth Rd last week never made the headlines, strangly and the shooting in Kale Rd Thamesmead last Thursday did not make it on here

WHAT ARE YOU ON ABOUT THE ONE AT KALE ROAD IS ON HERE WITH 3 DIFFERENT STORIES AND IT AS BEEN ALL OVER THE NEWS ALL WEEKEND

So what are two black geezers , doesnt matter where they are from, doing sitting in a ford fiesta in the middle of woolwich common estate? .

It is pretty obvious that this is either gang or drug related, people dont just shoot people for no reason why there are sitting in thier car!! I know this country is ridden with knife and gun crime, govenment are just not getting to grips with the problem, they talk good, but no actions to deal with it... I make a prediection that within the next month at least 2 more people will be murdered in south london / Kent!! Its that predicable now, lets hope it isnt somebody we care about!!

anon wrote:
The police should stop picking on innocent people when it comes to stop and searches. They should concerntrate on the people carrying guns and knives, they know who these people are but are too scared to search them. They should be given more power and the people carrying the weapons should get 5 years straight away. Woolwich and plumstead might be getting regenerated but it wont get rid of the scum.

I'm not involved in crime, nor ever have been - and would not object to being stop and searched. How are the police supposed to identify if you are innocent before requesting to stop and search - get you to fill in a form??

The whole area has more than it's fair share of vile individuals involved in dodgy, criminal activities. It needs zero tolerance to clean it up, that is the only way. But with the woolly liberals making excuses for the criminals - there's no chance so if you live in London you have to get used to it unless you vote differently at the next election!

Darren wrote:

lorrie, Abbey wood wrote: Ive got two sons that have been mugged by knife point. one last month in Godstow Road Abbey Wood and one today at the Abbey Ruins and both times its been black youths.

And your point is what Lorrie ? Your sons say to you that they got mugged by two black guys. I hope they told the police and its being investigated. A lot of blame is put upon black youths innocent or not, its known in Abbey Wood , Belvedere , Erith , Slade Green to blame black people for their crimes.

Lets not make this a situation where people are scared to identify the person/s race when describing criminals - the Press often use the terms white, Irish, Scottish, Welsh and that is not questioned.

Stats show that muggings have been disproportionately committed by particular groups in the past - and still possibly are. But it is quite common from the stats that certain cultures/communities criminal fraternities tend to be more active in specific crimes no matter what colour, class or race. Like it or not -the current levels of gun crime happening in London are MOSTLY (not 100% but a disproportionate percentage) linked to black on black crime and gangs.

Lorrie: my sympathy to you for your sons being mugged - it is a terrible experience for them to go through - and that should be acknowledged.

Darren,
Are you black?

Only cowards carry guns and join gangs because there too scared to start trouble alone, Gangs are like a herd of sheep, The game follow my leader springs to mind. Im glad i left that all behind at nursery school lol

Excuse me for being stupid, but its not down to the police how long these scum get, but down to the judges & inparticluar, down to the forever growing with our respects Mr G brown!! I wonder what he would do if it was someone close to him that was murdered.......

Simon Bull, web editor wrote:
Des, Was the Kale Rd incident a stabbing rather than a shooting? If so we've reported on that one quite extensively over the past few days. The other incident you mentioned isn't immediately familiar to me but then if it was a serious stabbing and was one we were told about by the police then I'm sure we would have done something. If you can give me a few more details on that one, I can look into it.

It happened last Weds 10th late night or Thurs 11th early hours
From what i have heard 2 black youths stabbed a gent.
I think but cant confirm someone either that night or a few nights before was either stabbed or someone attempted to stab them when they left the Birchwood pub also corner of Ampleforth

INFO wrote:
the person killed was not from the area and the killers are not local people or local gang. one more thing, the person killed has ...... before. RIP

If this information is right why does the person who wrote this contact the police ???????????

UP UNTIL DECEMBER LAST YEAR I LIVED ON THAT S**T HOLE ESTATE! IM SO GLAD I GOT MY FAMILY AWAY FROM THERE, MY ELDEST SON IS 14 AND WOULD GET A GOOD OLD FASHIONED HIDING IF I GOT A WHIFF THAT HE HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH GANGS. IVE SAID IT BEFORE ON HERE SEND THE SCUM TO BOOT CAMP OR ARMY.
MY THOUGHTS ARE WITH YOUNG LADS FAMILY GANG RELATED OR NOT HE WAS 18 FFS.

anon wrote:
The police should stop picking on innocent people when it comes to stop and searches. They should concerntrate on the people carrying guns and knives, they know who these people are but are too scared to search them. They should be given more power and the people carrying the weapons should get 5 years straight away. Woolwich and plumstead might be getting regenerated but it wont get rid of the scum.

the gangs rule the bouroughs not the police the police are scared off them this will only get worse the police need to do more

Darren, I think you need to desperately get off the racial bandwagon before someone gets hurt. I think the point with this incident is that it was, according to what I have read from various sources a black on black crime. Black on black crime happens as does any other type of crime. It just tends to be more violent and have more severe consiquences. If that wasn't the case do you think the Met would set up the whole trident thing? I've every confidence that the met wouldnt waste the hundreds and thousands of pounds that must fund the scheme just to be institutionally racist. Darren, the point is Steven Lawrence was a long time ago now. Lessons have been learn't and society is changing. What makes you think that the people of Kent (a less ethnically diverse populus) are going to be any less 'institutionally racist' than the Met. If anything, they could be more. Lets let the race card lie and just concentrate on finding out who did this and making it more difficult for the criminals to operate. If this is another black on black gang incident, lets support the police in targeting these gangs and giving them any info we might have.

Mike wrote:
Darren, I think you need to desperately get off the racial bandwagon before someone gets hurt. I think the point with this incident is that it was, according to what I have read from various sources a black on black crime. Black on black crime happens as does any other type of crime. It just tends to be more violent and have more severe consiquences. If that wasn\'t the case do you think the Met would set up the whole trident thing? I\'ve every confidence that the met wouldnt waste the hundreds and thousands of pounds that must fund the scheme just to be institutionally racist. Darren, the point is Steven Lawrence was a long time ago now. Lessons have been learn\'t and society is changing. What makes you think that the people of Kent (a less ethnically diverse populus) are going to be any less \'institutionally racist\' than the Met. If anything, they could be more. Lets let the race card lie and just concentrate on finding out who did this and making it more difficult for the criminals to operate. If this is another black on black gang incident, lets support the police in targeting these gangs and giving them any info we might have.

wot is the point of helping the police they are SCARED off the gangs

Time to get out of South East London.....see ya!!!

Des wrote:
Worrying thing is The stabbing in Ampleforth Rd last week never made the headlines, strangly and the shooting in Kale Rd Thamesmead last Thursday did not make it on here

Yeah, the murder last Thursday did make it on here amongst the many others that have.

Ben wrote:

Me wrote: Dear Mr G.Brown, it\'s good to see that you have your priorites right. Tax everyone up to the eyelids and turn a blind eye to all the innocent people that are being knifed and shot at the moment. Thanks very much. A citizen of crime ridden London.

I don\'t think some of these people being murdered are exactly \'innocent\'. They obviously have mixed with people they shouldn\'t have to get themselves in the situation where they\'re being murdered. The one in Thamesmead and the Woman in New Cross where innocent victims, but these teenagers being murdered are most likely involved in Drugs and other dodgy dealings.

Sorry Ben,
Please dont assume things. Philip was from peckham not the area, he was trying to make it off a bad estate and was actually at uni. U trying being brought up in an area where u can walk next door and buy drugs any type, and then have the chance to make a quick buck, while the local gov hardly help the black youth make it out of the gutter to uni and HE MADE IT! so please dnt chat crap u kno ****. For all u kno, he could of been linking a girl. so shutup please.

Excuse me but people don't get shot for nothing while sitting in their car - why were these 2 youths sitting in their car on a dodgy estate? Linking a girl you say? Well we'll find out after the police have taken statements and release more details yeah?

The assumption was made on legible grounds considering most people who are shot or are shooting themselves are related to gangs, and usually these incidents happen in areas where gangs are present such as this incident.

If you knew this boy like your message implies, then I'm sorry for you that he's been murdered. At 18 it's not what anyone wants somebody so young to go through. But you have to remember this is a 'comment' section on peoples opinions on this shooting, people are interested in what actually happened.

As for somebody going Uni it doesn't automatically make them innocent, some intelligent people still get caught up in things they shouldn't.

As for being brough up in an area where people sell drugs etc... I was... maybe not on my direct doorstep but not too far away. Luckily I moved away before I got drawn into anything major, and I know some people don't have that option.

I wasn't talking crap, I was making an opinionated assumption from what I've read, seen and heard on the local streets I've been brought up on.

If I offended you then sorry.

Darren, what is your obsession with blaming the police? I remember white boys being killed by black gangs and the crimes never being solved as well. The only people at fault for these and all crimes are the people that commit them. Until people stop taking responsibility for their own actions instead of blaming an easy target such as the feds or the government there will always be problems. I myself grew up on an estate in Thamesmead. Drugs were readily available, but I chose not to take them, and to make a success of myself, which I have done. In my mid-twenties, I own my second house, which I have been able to do by grafting. It has nothing to do with my colour, and everything to do with not being a lazy idiot.

An amnesty is a ridiculous idea, people should not have these tools in the first place. Why would you go out with a knife or a gun if you was not going to use it. One way to stop this would be to have a clear policy, caught with a knife or gun, 25 years in prison. Caught using them, then life imprisoment, with life meaning life.

Sir Paul Condon got hammered for saying that most robberies etc are committed by young black males. All he did was tell the truth. Now, the community are asking why more is not being done to stop and search their kids? Amazing, the answer is because when they do get searched they play the race card. four black youths of about 16 tried to rob two 11 year old white kids in lodge hill park on Saturday. I wonder if that will be treated as racist? Of course it will not.

I'm sick of everyone mollycoddling these toerags. Take responsibility and make something of your lives. No-one has a god given right to have everything handed to them on a plate - you have to work for it.

It is terrible that so many youngsters are leaving us at such an early age, and my hearts go out to the families. Let’s not just assume that because someone was a student that they were innocent.

I'm also sick of people making excuses for crimes and using every possible easy target to blame for any trouble, rather than the people involved themselves.

I'm tired of people saying that just because kids come from a poor or supposedly deprived background, there is some sort of justification for them getting involved in crime. It's utter rubbish.

Getting involved in crime is a sign of weakness and stupidity, and has nothing whatsoever to do with race or where a person grew up.

So what if places like Peckham, Lewisham or Thamesmead are a bit rough, it does not automatically follow that kids will end up on drugs or leading a life of crime as a wannabe gangster. It is about upbringing, knowing right from wrong and most of all it is about making the right personal choices.

There can be no excuses or no-one / nothing to blame for being involved in gangs and crime other than suffering from a lack of brain cells or not having the backbone to stay away from trouble.

This place is becoming more disgraceful by the day, and i am starting to become embarressed to say that i am from england. I grew up in abbeywood, a town that many people loved to live in. now it is the complete opposite and that is why me and my family moved out. i cannot believe how much the area has changed in recent years!
Am i the only one who thinks that there may be a connection between the rise in immigration and the rise in crime? i am not saying that this is the reason but many members of these so called 'gangs' originate, or their family originate from more violent countries. could it be that they are bringing this violence with them as this is the type of environment that they know? It seems that youths pick up on this behaviour and start to follow it as they think it will earn them respect. as i say, i am not implying that this is the cause so i don't want people to twist my words and make out that i am being racist because that is not what i am saying at all. I just can't help but think there may be a connection and the government needs to do something about it so we can all live in a town that we are not scared to walk around in!!!

This boy was my neighbour...it broke my heart to hear the news yesterday!! He was an intelligent, handsome young man with his whole life ahead of him...I mean he just started uni and was doing well for himself. This has to stop!! When will people wise up and stop all this crap?? May his soul rest in perfect peace

Tasha wrote:
This place is becoming more disgraceful by the day, and i am starting to become embarressed to say that i am from england. I grew up in abbeywood, a town that many people loved to live in. now it is the complete opposite and that is why me and my family moved out. i cannot believe how much the area has changed in recent years!
Am i the only one who thinks that there may be a connection between the rise in immigration and the rise in crime? i am not saying that this is the reason but many members of these so called 'gangs' originate, or their family originate from more violent countries. could it be that they are bringing this violence with them as this is the type of environment that they know? It seems that youths pick up on this behaviour and start to follow it as they think it will earn them respect. as i say, i am not implying that this is the cause so i don't want people to twist my words and make out that i am being racist because that is not what i am saying at all. I just can't help but think there may be a connection and the government needs to do something about it so we can all live in a town that we are not scared to walk around in!!!

You hit the nail on the head.

It's no coincidence that the influx of immigrants has had an impact on crime in cities like London, especially gang related.

Alot of people from countries like 'Somalia' see violence day in day out over there, then they think it's acceptable to bring it into what was a fairly civilised country like England.

By all means this is not an attack on people not born here, but some of the people allowed over have no morals and no respect for our own culture and think it's acceptable to run riot on our streets.

I feel sorry for your having been led down the primrose path by your politicians. Maybe it's time YOU take your country back from the criminals no matter who they may be.

I don't buy into the immigration equals crime argument for one second. It's just a lame excuse for people to make thinly veiled racist remarks along the lines of all people from Somalia must be violent criminals.

The problem these days is the breakdown of our society which generally has nothing to do with immigration but much more to do with a lack of proper authority for kids.

Too many kids these days seem to put 'respect' ahead of their (and other people's) lives. Too many kids associate 'respect' with violence. They would rather be dead and respected than alive and with no so-called cred. The really sick thing is their definition of what 'respect' is, is so wide of the mark that they don't know the meaning of the word.

Harvey wrote:
I\'m also sick of people making excuses for crimes and using every possible easy target to blame for any trouble, rather than the people involved themselves. I\'m tired of people saying that just because kids come from a poor or supposedly deprived background, there is some sort of justification for them getting involved in crime. It\'s utter rubbish. Getting involved in crime is a sign of weakness and stupidity, and has nothing whatsoever to do with race or where a person grew up. So what if places like Peckham, Lewisham or Thamesmead are a bit rough, it does not automatically follow that kids will end up on drugs or leading a life of crime as a wannabe gangster. It is about upbringing, knowing right from wrong and most of all it is about making the right personal choices. There can be no excuses or no-one / nothing to blame for being involved in gangs and crime other than suffering from a lack of brain cells or not having the backbone to stay away from trouble.

This comment made me laugh, why? Because ive seen personally parents struglle thorugh 2 keep their kids on the right path, encourage them to do the right thing. But to no avial, why becasue of the peer groups and enviornment, if you put a person in a jungle they will adapt with that enviornement to survive! By the government allowing this circle of deprevation to contiune, by allowing guns on our street its going to contiune. Do u remeber the days when people would beat eachother up, with FISTS? I do. Its changed in the space of 3-4years. how? Did the government just manage to miss the one arsenal shipment into the country?? NO PEOPLE. Lets think about it, guns didnt just appear out of no where.

Comments like just cos ur from peckham etc....doesnt mean u should be a wannabe gangsta is crap. There not wannabe gangstats it what they see and breathe everyday. It's easy to say i packed up and moved. how did u do that!!?!? U HAD MONEY, WE DONT! Silly people, saying silly things.

Immigration since the early 90s from Africa to Eastern Europe has contributed to violent crime in south east london. Im not the problem , but part of the solution. I do not feel The Metropolitan police or Trident can reduce violent crime in London , this is not something I decided over my cornflakes. I am mixed race but if you saw me you would say im black. I have witnessed crimes by white people who then blamed black youths of the crimes when the police got involved. Ive been stopped and searched on a regular basis throughout being an adult. Im in my late 30s and do not have a criminal record or received a caution but I have my DNA on the national database.
The Black community in south london tend not to approach the police as we are looked upon as criminals anyway without committing a crime.
The Met Police introduced Trident so the Met does not have to deal with the case. I want the violence to stop not because I lived in woolwich and plumstead but for the black community who will be persecuted continually with more stop and searches and harrassment from the police. I never needed a weapon other than my hands to sort out my problems and did not need to mug anyone to buy a pair of trainers.

I agree to the above, I don't believe these kids want to be gangstas (as such), it has just got that bad that kids are believing that "that's life". I know not all kids carry weapons, but you only have to listen to the way they talk to know that something is seriously wrong...

Anon wrote:

Harvey wrote: I\\\'m also sick of people making excuses for crimes and using every possible easy target to blame for any trouble, rather than the people involved themselves. I\\\'m tired of people saying that just because kids come from a poor or supposedly deprived background, there is some sort of justification for them getting involved in crime. It\\\'s utter rubbish. Getting involved in crime is a sign of weakness and stupidity, and has nothing whatsoever to do with race or where a person grew up. So what if places like Peckham, Lewisham or Thamesmead are a bit rough, it does not automatically follow that kids will end up on drugs or leading a life of crime as a wannabe gangster. It is about upbringing, knowing right from wrong and most of all it is about making the right personal choices. There can be no excuses or no-one / nothing to blame for being involved in gangs and crime other than suffering from a lack of brain cells or not having the backbone to stay away from trouble.

This comment made me laugh, why? Because ive seen personally parents struglle thorugh 2 keep their kids on the right path, encourage them to do the right thing. But to no avial, why becasue of the peer groups and enviornment, if you put a person in a jungle they will adapt with that enviornement to survive! By the government allowing this circle of deprevation to contiune, by allowing guns on our street its going to contiune. Do u remeber the days when people would beat eachother up, with FISTS? I do. Its changed in the space of 3-4years. how? Did the government just manage to miss the one arsenal shipment into the country?? NO PEOPLE. Lets think about it, guns didnt just appear out of no where. Comments like just cos ur from peckham etc....doesnt mean u should be a wannabe gangsta is crap. There not wannabe gangstats it what they see and breathe everyday. It\'s easy to say i packed up and moved. how did u do that!!?!? U HAD MONEY, WE DONT! Silly people, saying silly things.

I agree fully with this comment.

Some of the above comments have basically said that black people are to blame for the majority if not all gun crime, muggings etc... These people obviosuly have thought about it....NOT! People need to look deeper than the surface. ill admit maybe the majority of gun crimes are commited by black people. Why? Because they are running drugs for who? yes White people, you think that balck people are on top of the drug food chain! NO. You blame the Gov for failing schools, poor hospitals. Why not blame the hospital cleaners for MRSA obviosuly they are not cleaning the hospitals properly??! But we don't. why? It's funny to think that excatly the same thing goes on in crime, white people control the drugs, they control the gun imports, they are the milionaries drug barons who make the black people (who are stupid for doing it ) rund the face value crime that we all see. So please people step out of ur shell, and see the bigger problem.

Anon wrote:

Harvey wrote: I\'m also sick of people making excuses for crimes and using every possible easy target to blame for any trouble, rather than the people involved themselves. I\'m tired of people saying that just because kids come from a poor or supposedly deprived background, there is some sort of justification for them getting involved in crime. It\'s utter rubbish. Getting involved in crime is a sign of weakness and stupidity, and has nothing whatsoever to do with race or where a person grew up. So what if places like Peckham, Lewisham or Thamesmead are a bit rough, it does not automatically follow that kids will end up on drugs or leading a life of crime as a wannabe gangster. It is about upbringing, knowing right from wrong and most of all it is about making the right personal choices. There can be no excuses or no-one / nothing to blame for being involved in gangs and crime other than suffering from a lack of brain cells or not having the backbone to stay away from trouble.

This comment made me laugh, why? Because ive seen personally parents struglle thorugh 2 keep their kids on the right path, encourage them to do the right thing. But to no avial, why becasue of the peer groups and enviornment, if you put a person in a jungle they will adapt with that enviornement to survive! By the government allowing this circle of deprevation to contiune, by allowing guns on our street its going to contiune. Do u remeber the days when people would beat eachother up, with FISTS? I do. Its changed in the space of 3-4years. how? Did the government just manage to miss the one arsenal shipment into the country?? NO PEOPLE. Lets think about it, guns didnt just appear out of no where. Comments like just cos ur from peckham etc....doesnt mean u should be a wannabe gangsta is crap. There not wannabe gangstats it what they see and breathe everyday. It's easy to say i packed up and moved. how did u do that!!?!? U HAD MONEY, WE DONT! Silly people, saying silly things.

Yawn yawn yawn yawn and yawn. Yet more excuses.

Poor them, they have no money.

Poor them, they live in a 'jungle'. (What a joke - if you saw the conditions kids on some other cities around the world live in, you would know how pathetic saying south London is a 'jungle' really is)

Poor them, it's not their fault - the government is to blame for everything.

Boring.

I'm sick of people like you saying these murdering kids are only doing it because it's all they know or it's the only way they know how to behave. Utter tosh.

I was born in Woolwich and grew up in Thamesmead, and I haven't grown up to be a murdering thug. If it was the 'environment' to blame then everyone who grows up around here would grow up into criminals. But not everyone does. The ones who do turn to violence and drugs do so because of poor choices they make and because of poor parenting, by people like you who prefer to blame everyone and everything else for their own and their kids' failings.

Anon wrote:

Anon wrote:

Harvey wrote: I\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'m also sick of people making excuses for crimes and using every possible easy target to blame for any trouble, rather than the people involved themselves. I\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'m tired of people saying that just because kids come from a poor or supposedly deprived background, there is some sort of justification for them getting involved in crime. It\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'s utter rubbish. Getting involved in crime is a sign of weakness and stupidity, and has nothing whatsoever to do with race or where a person grew up. So what if places like Peckham, Lewisham or Thamesmead are a bit rough, it does not automatically follow that kids will end up on drugs or leading a life of crime as a wannabe gangster. It is about upbringing, knowing right from wrong and most of all it is about making the right personal choices. There can be no excuses or no-one / nothing to blame for being involved in gangs and crime other than suffering from a lack of brain cells or not having the backbone to stay away from trouble.

This comment made me laugh, why? Because ive seen personally parents struglle thorugh 2 keep their kids on the right path, encourage them to do the right thing. But to no avial, why becasue of the peer groups and enviornment, if you put a person in a jungle they will adapt with that enviornement to survive! By the government allowing this circle of deprevation to contiune, by allowing guns on our street its going to contiune. Do u remeber the days when people would beat eachother up, with FISTS? I do. Its changed in the space of 3-4years. how? Did the government just manage to miss the one arsenal shipment into the country?? NO PEOPLE. Lets think about it, guns didnt just appear out of no where. Comments like just cos ur from peckham etc....doesnt mean u should be a wannabe gangsta is crap. There not wannabe gangstats it what they see and breathe everyday. It\\\\\\\'s easy to say i packed up and moved. how did u do that!!?!? U HAD MONEY, WE DONT! Silly people, saying silly things.

I agree fully with this comment. Some of the above comments have basically said that black people are to blame for the majority if not all gun crime, muggings etc... These people obviosuly have thought about it....NOT! People need to look deeper than the surface. ill admit maybe the majority of gun crimes are commited by black people. Why? Because they are running drugs for who? yes White people, you think that balck people are on top of the drug food chain! NO. You blame the Gov for failing schools, poor hospitals. Why not blame the hospital cleaners for MRSA obviosuly they are not cleaning the hospitals properly??! But we don\\\'t. why? It\\\'s funny to think that excatly the same thing goes on in crime, white people control the drugs, they control the gun imports, they are the milionaries drug barons who make the black people (who are stupid for doing it ) rund the face value crime that we all see. So please people step out of ur shell, and see the bigger problem.

Well said!

Darren, your making out like black kids are only guilty of crimes because white kids are accusing them... rubbish, they are guilty of the crimes because they are committing them! As are white kids and all other races for that matter! I am under no illusion that only black people are involved in violent crimes (one of the accused for the stabbing in Kale road is definitely white), but you only have to watch the news to see that a majority of these incidences involve black youths... why? I can't give the answers, but the evidence is there, lets not beat around the bush.

Above... White people control drugs guns etc and black people run it for them????? So black people are being told what to do by white people and that's why the shoot each other???? AARRGGHH what utter BS! I have never heard so much crap! Do realise how big the African community is in Thamesmead?? do realise how much crime they have brought with them???? White people are not behind their DRUGS/FRAUD/PEOPLE TRAFFICING trust me!!!! Don't be so NAIVE!! Maybe that kind of rubbish was true 10 - 15 years ago, but they run they're own sh*t now!

Harvey wrote:

Anon wrote:

Harvey wrote: I\\\\\\\'m also sick of people making excuses for crimes and using every possible easy target to blame for any trouble, rather than the people involved themselves. I\\\\\\\'m tired of people saying that just because kids come from a poor or supposedly deprived background, there is some sort of justification for them getting involved in crime. It\\\\\\\'s utter rubbish. Getting involved in crime is a sign of weakness and stupidity, and has nothing whatsoever to do with race or where a person grew up. So what if places like Peckham, Lewisham or Thamesmead are a bit rough, it does not automatically follow that kids will end up on drugs or leading a life of crime as a wannabe gangster. It is about upbringing, knowing right from wrong and most of all it is about making the right personal choices. There can be no excuses or no-one / nothing to blame for being involved in gangs and crime other than suffering from a lack of brain cells or not having the backbone to stay away from trouble.

This comment made me laugh, why? Because ive seen personally parents struglle thorugh 2 keep their kids on the right path, encourage them to do the right thing. But to no avial, why becasue of the peer groups and enviornment, if you put a person in a jungle they will adapt with that enviornement to survive! By the government allowing this circle of deprevation to contiune, by allowing guns on our street its going to contiune. Do u remeber the days when people would beat eachother up, with FISTS? I do. Its changed in the space of 3-4years. how? Did the government just manage to miss the one arsenal shipment into the country?? NO PEOPLE. Lets think about it, guns didnt just appear out of no where. Comments like just cos ur from peckham etc....doesnt mean u should be a wannabe gangsta is crap. There not wannabe gangstats it what they see and breathe everyday. It\\\'s easy to say i packed up and moved. how did u do that!!?!? U HAD MONEY, WE DONT! Silly people, saying silly things.

Yawn yawn yawn yawn and yawn. Yet more excuses. Poor them, they have no money. Poor them, they live in a \\\'jungle\\\'. (What a joke - if you saw the conditions kids on some other cities around the world live in, you would know how pathetic saying south London is a \\\'jungle\\\' really is) Poor them, it\\\'s not their fault - the government is to blame for everything. Boring. I\\\'m sick of people like you saying these murdering kids are only doing it because it\\\'s all they know or it\\\'s the only way they know how to behave. Utter tosh. I was born in Woolwich and grew up in Thamesmead, and I haven\\\'t grown up to be a murdering thug. If it was the \\\'environment\\\' to blame then everyone who grows up around here would grow up into criminals. But not everyone does. The ones who do turn to violence and drugs do so because of poor choices they make and because of poor parenting, by people like you who prefer to blame everyone and everything else for their own and their kids\\\' failings.

Harvey I appreciate you taking time to comment on this issue.
But u really do seem to be a one track minded person who does not see both sides to the issue.
1. Black boys are stupid for getting involed yes i fully agree
However to say that south london isnt a jungle when compared to other places in the world is so ridciulous it defies logic. How can u compare the undeveleoped favella of Brazil to London, how can u compare the indian villages to London, how can u comapre afrcia where people walk 3miles everyday for water to London!!! you can't. London is meant to be one the most advanced cultures in the world. But yet the gov can't control guns on our streets?? hmmm... Again another one that deifes logic, like was said before 4years ago there wasnt guns on the street for any1 to get one, no there is. how? im not a genius sociologist or anything. but a clearer picture certaintly starts to devlop.

Harvey I plead that before you start discussing and POISONING other people with your bodering on racists views, you research both sides of the issue to have a more balanced and coherent view. Because at the moment you have the disscsion/argumentat



ive skills as the Lay man on the street that watches BBC News every now and again.

I have just sat a read all of the comment's that have been posted and it just seems there is a mass blame game going on.
There is no particular body that is too blame.
The police,lets face it,have lost grip on crime in that part of london and have done for a long time.
No one has any faith left in the police.
Then there is parent's and whether you like it or not are responsible for what there children do.
I agree with the man who wrote that if his son was up to know good he would give him an old fashion clip round the ear.
Now there's the rub,I remember when we had these so called do-gooders in government saying you could'nt smack your kids anymore but only talk to them nicely. And teachers that are'nt allowed to discipline pupils,Well look where that's got us,a country with youngsters out of control with no respect for anyone including there parents.How anyone is going to be able to turn this around god only knows.It's gone too far for too long and now it's too late.
The only solution might be is for us ordinary law abbiding folk who have had enough of these crimes is to try and take the streets back and make them safe again.How we do that i really don't know but maybe between us all we could come up with something constructive. what have we got to lose, that's if we have.'t lost everything already.

l wrote:
Above... White people control drugs guns etc and black people run it for them????? So black people are being told what to do by white people and that\'s why the shoot each other???? AARRGGHH what utter BS! I have never heard so much crap! Do realise how big the African community is in Thamesmead?? do realise how much crime they have brought with them???? White people are not behind their DRUGS/FRAUD/PEOPLE TRAFFICING trust me!!!! Don\'t be so NAIVE!! Maybe that kind of rubbish was true 10 - 15 years ago, but they run they\'re own sh*t now!

Very silly comment.
I never said that white people are telling the black people what to do.
In fact most of the black boys selling drugs have no idea where the drugs they are selling come from, tehy have no idea where the guns they are getting come from.
But sitting pretty at the top of the tree isnt always the Yardie black man. Fact. If you don't beleive me, ask the Gov.
And to blame it on the African community, shows a lack of respect for African people, its very NAIVE in fact STUPID of you 1. To call all black people African
2. To generalise and say do you know how much crime they have brought with them. Was there not crime in the area before. I thought so. Did the black people move in overnight, no. Where people getting shot in the area 3 years ago. no. was there balck people there then. yes.
Again i ask to guns make themselves.

Anon - Why is my comment sillier than yours? I'm not too Naive to realise that not all crime comes from white people (as you pretty much suggested), I believe that there are alot cultures/races/commu

nities dishing out their fair share of crime - not just whiet people!! (I was actually using the situation in Thamesmead as an example of organised crime that has not originated from WHITE people as you have suggested). Do you live in Thamesmead? If you do, you would know what I mean by African community (which is what I said, not that all black people are african maybe you should read properly) If you are talking about asking people things - why don't you run along and ask about the Met about Thamesmead (African Community). Yes there was crime in Thamesmead and has been for as long as I have lived here (like anywhere else in the world) and yes people from all different races committing crimes, but that has increased tenfold since there was a campaign for African immigrants to move to Thamesmead. P.s. If you are going to accuse me of generalsing then... not all black criminals are YARDIES!! Just like not all African people in Thamesmead aren't criminals.

This is directed at the 'anon' who was attacking my earlier comments. I have to be specific because there are so many 'anons' on here - it's ridiculous. It's an online forum for god's sake - just make up a name like I have instead everyone just being anon.

Anyway, anon who chose to attack my earlier comments. I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt and believe you are not really as dumb as you came across. I hope you just accidentally misread what I said instead of you being a bit thick.

How dare you accuse me of bordering on racism. I haven't mentioned race in any of my comments. I also didn't say black people were stupid for getting involved in crime - I said all criminals are stupid.

The main point I was making was that people should not blame government, police, immigration or any other lame reasons for violent crime. The ones to blame are the kids doing these crimes themselves and their poor excuses of parents. It's pathetic to blame a lack of money or living in a poor area - it just dodges the issues and passes responsibility, which it seems is ALL that some people are capable of doing.

South London is not a jungle. Is that clear enough for you? South London is part of a prosperous and vibrant city. The fact that some peopel chose to go down the gans and guns route instead is a tragedy but only they themselves are to blame for their actions and the consequences of those actions.

L wrote:
Anon - Why is my comment sillier than yours? I\'m not too Naive to realise that not all crime comes from white people (as you pretty much suggested), I believe that there are alot cultures/races/commu nities dishing out their fair share of crime - not just whiet people!! (I was actually using the situation in Thamesmead as an example of organised crime that has not originated from WHITE people as you have suggested). Do you live in Thamesmead? If you do, you would know what I mean by African community (which is what I said, not that all black people are african maybe you should read properly) If you are talking about asking people things - why don\'t you run along and ask about the Met about Thamesmead (African Community). Yes there was crime in Thamesmead and has been for as long as I have lived here (like anywhere else in the world) and yes people from all different races committing crimes, but that has increased tenfold since there was a campaign for African immigrants to move to Thamesmead. P.s. If you are going to accuse me of generalsing then... not all black criminals are YARDIES!! Just like not all African people in Thamesmead aren\'t criminals.

Oh my friend. Why do you contiune to misread and misquote.
I did not say all black people were Yardies, I purely used this as an example of how misguided it is to GENERLALISE! And i will tell you now, I did not and would never for a second suggest that all crime comes from white people. That would be stupid! I have only asked the question. Where do the guns come from? Where do the drugs come from? That all the black boys (stupid for it) are pushing?? I doubt they walked into B&Q and purchased a semi-automatic or bought a ticket to cuba purcahsed a gun and a kilo of coccaine and boarderd the plane and got off and walked right thorugh customs. Do u understand what im saying. We can even leave teh drugs aside, becasue drugs have been getting into the UK for decades upon decades now. Guns however have not!! Did black people all of a sudden get that much smarter and discover a new magic way to smuggle them in. I think not. I hope this sheds some light on the point im trying to get across to you.

T-BLOCK consist of mainly african boys, same as CHERRY ORCHARD AND THE WOOLWICH BOYS ALL BLACK. i work in the hopsital where the dead boy was taken there was no respect from any of the gang members giving any imformation regarding the dead boy details so the hosp could inform his parents they got told that the gang members were his family, they had to section off the resuss dept where a&e were working on the dead boy cause the so called gang members were making so much trouble, we are in a hospital for god sake. my answer is YOU WANT TO RUN WITH A GANG AND MESS WITH GUNS & KNIVES COS U THINK IS COOL, THEN EXCEPT THE CONCEQUENCES. My son also got mugged by T BLOCK at the abbey ruins last year made of with a tenner, mobile phone, gold necklace and braclet. five of them hitting him in the head, iron bar whacked round his back with another one swinging a sword, scary yeah. for a seventeen year old.

Nah you definitely did suggest that all crime comes from white people...

Quote from anon:"ill admit maybe the majority of gun crimes are commited by black people. Why? Because they are running drugs for who? yes White people".

Surely you can see why I might get confused by your comments. As Mike said above it is hard to tell which anon said it, but it doesn't really matter because you are both agreeing with each other. I was being Ironic with my comment about Yardies, because I wasn't actually generalising and so it seems neither was you! It's funny because you say your not saying white people people are behind black crime, but by the end of your last post your again making round about suggestions as to who got the guns in the country, are you saying black people are not capable of getting guns into this country?

Quote anon: "Did black people all of a sudden get that much smarter and discover a new magic way to smuggle them in. I think not."

Because I beg to differ!!

The guns are from europe after the wars in eastern europe. Some larger guns are from Russia. In my opinion the criminals from these countries used these weapons as trade to get into the criminal underworld. The underworld then sold the guns onto the streets to finance their income. Immigrants from Africa and Europe know about war as the reason for them being here is because their countries are engaged in war. Sadly the guns ended up in the hands of these people. To a certain degree immigrants and migrants need to learn how to be civilised.

Posted by: Anon, London
Some of the above comments have basically said that black people are to blame for the majority if not all gun crime, muggings etc... These people obviosuly have thought about it....NOT! People need to look deeper than the surface. ill admit maybe the majority of gun crimes are commited by black people. Why? Because they are running drugs for who? yes White people, you think that balck people are on top of the drug food chain! NO. You blame the Gov for failing schools, poor hospitals. Why not blame the hospital cleaners for MRSA obviosuly they are not cleaning the hospitals properly??! But we don't. why? It's funny to think that excatly the same thing goes on in crime, white people control the drugs, they control the gun imports, they are the milionaries drug barons who make the black people (who are stupid for doing it ) rund the face value crime that we all see. So please people step out of ur shell, and see the bigger problem.

how can you say that white people are the drug dealers and black people are used as run arounds? do you no every dealer there is in the south east for you to have the knowledge to say that? no, didnt think so. maybe you should look deeper into the surface instead of telling everyone else to! i have no doubt that some dealers are white, but there are also some that are black! and there is no way that you can say white people make black youths carry a gun around with them either! it is up to them whether they want to or not! if someone is offered a gun, all they have to do is say no!! i seems as if your trying to say that the whites are at the top of everything, wasn't england originally a white mans country? im not debating blacks against whites, but after that comment was made i wanted to say what i thought to that. The other comments made about the hospitals etc however i fully agree with, but i think that is to be saved for a different story.

Harry wrote:

Tasha wrote: This place is becoming more disgraceful by the day, and i am starting to become embarressed to say that i am from england. I grew up in abbeywood, a town that many people loved to live in. now it is the complete opposite and that is why me and my family moved out. i cannot believe how much the area has changed in recent years! Am i the only one who thinks that there may be a connection between the rise in immigration and the rise in crime? i am not saying that this is the reason but many members of these so called \'gangs\' originate, or their family originate from more violent countries. could it be that they are bringing this violence with them as this is the type of environment that they know? It seems that youths pick up on this behaviour and start to follow it as they think it will earn them respect. as i say, i am not implying that this is the cause so i don\'t want people to twist my words and make out that i am being racist because that is not what i am saying at all. I just can\'t help but think there may be a connection and the government needs to do something about it so we can all live in a town that we are not scared to walk around in!!!

You hit the nail on the head. It\'s no coincidence that the influx of immigrants has had an impact on crime in cities like London, especially gang related. Alot of people from countries like \'Somalia\' see violence day in day out over there, then they think it\'s acceptable to bring it into what was a fairly civilised country like England. By all means this is not an attack on people not born here, but some of the people allowed over have no morals and no respect for our own culture and think it\'s acceptable to run riot on our streets.

its all very well all of us sitting behind a PC giving our comments and expressing our beef but its about time something was done. yes these immigrants come from grief stricken countries and flee because they fear for their lives. I FEAR FOR MY LIFE WALKING AROUND MY OWN STREETS ....WHO WORRY'S ABOUT ME???? These immigrants have lived a life of violence where guns and knives are part of every day life. and WE yes the BRITISH let them come over here..calling the shots and making our offspring look like the criminals. if and when one of ours is every caught with an offensive weapon it is carried for self defence. i am a normal working class citizen with a comprehensive education, not a snob or vice versa but i tell you what i would not like to be in the shoes of our youth of today. if things do not get sorted out soon and very soon we are all going to fins ourselves in the middle of a civil war.

Anon

You really are stupid
How can the white man take the blame.

If i told you to stick you head in a oven would you?? No

FFS stop passing teh buck

i actually knew philip and he was such a nice humble person. he never started unecessary problems wiv people he was actually tryin 2 do somethin positve with his life...most of da boys dat live in peckham r not doin anyfing wiv dere lives bt philip actually attented university...i know his whole family he has 4 brothers and i know that they are really grievein at the moment so yu ppl dat dnt kno him dnt **** on dis and say its abvious dat he was doin some sort of dodgy dealing because he wasnt he didnt deserve 2 die does somalians fink dat they run tings dwn in woolwich dats y alot of people do not like dem and dey want 2 hurt dem...all im saying is dat whoever did dis has made a very very big mistake becasue philip was very well known and respected in peckham so dere will be ppl dat want revenge...everyone shud b on guard because a war between woolwich/plumstaed sides and peckham sides has probably started because of dis tragedy RIP Philip Yu'll Neva B 4gotton G_xxx..

A civil war? An interesting idea. Put the army - the real army and not the fake army these 'soldiers' who make up the gangs claim to be - on the streets to round up the gun-toting morons who go around shooting each other and innocent victims. These so-called hard men would not last five minutes if they came up against proper soldiers. Then maybe we would see who has the 'respect'.

"a war between woolwich/plumstaed sides and peckham sides has probably started because of dis tragedy"

A war?! A war for what? A war for territory? A war for respect?

These gangs are even more deluded than their criminal actions would suggest if they seriously think they are fighting a war.

The reality that by talking about something that none of you are doing anything to change is meaningless. You can say t block are bad etc when all you know is what you read. Do the majority of you oppose them? I.e. do u tell them to stop when committing crimes. When you actually start realising that acting on the problem rather than blaming Gordan Brown causes more positives, then be my guest to start talking about black and white gang violence. Until then you may as well be one of the gang members as well. I new Phillip due to the fact that we were in the same class together, but yet all of you assume due to the fact that hes black automatically he's affiliated with a gang. Then the dumbest statement comes to light. The "boys were making trouble" said by K. So hypothetically speaking if someone has just shot your son or somone close to you your going to practically sit on your a** and keep your mouth silent while ur son departs from you. BS on that note. The reality is mine an friends of Phillip were acting the way they were in order to vent agression. Ok so some people would act different but what you must understand is we all act uniquely when someone we care about is in trouble or on their death bed in Phil's case. The reason i wrote this is cause as i mentionned previously, i knew Phillip if you dont believe me thats entirely up to you, but he would be thinking its over now move on with the next chapter, stop venting all ur frustrations of gun crime on too my episode and if your man enough, do something in order to tackle it. I had to do this because my heartfelt apologies go out to his family at this time. I didnt say this while you were alive phil, but you were my boi and i miss you. I no Gods got better plans for you up there, but until the day we meet again its just see you soon for now. R.I.P. Phillip from your sociology buddy.

What people fail to understand is that WE ALL Weather,Black,white Asian etc have some sort of racist in us ,should it be whites to the Scotish,should it be Indians to the Pakistanis or the Black West Indians to the Africans or even Africans to other Africans.Stop blaiming the Police and look to your people in your community and stop the killing.One thing that is obvious is that a majority of the youths being killed are BLACK,and it needs to stop.Maybe they should take thease killers to the moruge and to the funerals of the people they kill and the everlasting effect it causes the family.

sarah wrote:

Harry wrote:

Tasha wrote: This place is becoming more disgraceful by the day, and i am starting to become embarressed to say that i am from england. I grew up in abbeywood, a town that many people loved to live in. now it is the complete opposite and that is why me and my family moved out. i cannot believe how much the area has changed in recent years! Am i the only one who thinks that there may be a connection between the rise in immigration and the rise in crime? i am not saying that this is the reason but many members of these so called \\\'gangs\\\' originate, or their family originate from more violent countries. could it be that they are bringing this violence with them as this is the type of environment that they know? It seems that youths pick up on this behaviour and start to follow it as they think it will earn them respect. as i say, i am not implying that this is the cause so i don\\\'t want people to twist my words and make out that i am being racist because that is not what i am saying at all. I just can\\\'t help but think there may be a connection and the government needs to do something about it so we can all live in a town that we are not scared to walk around in!!!

You hit the nail on the head. It\\\'s no coincidence that the influx of immigrants has had an impact on crime in cities like London, especially gang related. Alot of people from countries like \\\'Somalia\\\' see violence day in day out over there, then they think it\\\'s acceptable to bring it into what was a fairly civilised country like England. By all means this is not an attack on people not born here, but some of the people allowed over have no morals and no respect for our own culture and think it\\\'s acceptable to run riot on our streets.

its all very well all of us sitting behind a PC giving our comments and expressing our beef but its about time something was done. yes these immigrants come from grief stricken countries and flee because they fear for their lives. I FEAR FOR MY LIFE WALKING AROUND MY OWN STREETS ....WHO WORRY\'S ABOUT ME???? These immigrants have lived a life of violence where guns and knives are part of every day life. and WE yes the BRITISH let them come over here..calling the shots and making our offspring look like the criminals. if and when one of ours is every caught with an offensive weapon it is carried for self defence. i am a normal working class citizen with a comprehensive education, not a snob or vice versa but i tell you what i would not like to be in the shoes of our youth of today. if things do not get sorted out soon and very soon we are all going to fins ourselves in the middle of a civil war.

I couldnt have put it better myself. In years to come people are going to ask how on earth immigration on this level was ever allowed to happen.

how many more mothers will cry because of where the choose to live. phillip had his life sorted out he was againgst gun and knife crime. in my college he set up a boys group encouraging youths to avoid gun crime. everyone askes this question why do the good have to die young. God bless his murderes. my cndolences to the family especially his siblings that looked up to him. rest in perfect peace phil xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

a response to anon posted at6.39pm you stupid little person, i was working that nite i saw it with my own eyes, there were none of philips family members there only the gang members, they acted like a pack of animals with security had to be called, while there is other people there with their relatives dying do not need to witness their behaviour. NO F***ING RESPECT FOR ANY ONE BUT THEM SELVES.and yes i agree most africans have came from, or seen a violence, but living in this country should be better life than the one you had, so instead of killing people you should be kissing the ground you walk on every morning and saying THANK THE LORD FOR A BETTER LIFE, cause you get hand outs, dole money and free health service some thing you wouldnt get in AFRICA.

An 18 year old young man has had his life halted. His parents will never meet his children, his brothers will never stand next to him at his wedding. He will not attend his graduation..........


.....

The above comments from people include so many assumptions, why is it that if a black teenager is killed the first thing their family and friends have to defend is whether they are in a gang or not.

Perhaps Phillip was in the wrong place at the wrong time, until I know other wise I will give the benefit of doubt.

There are good and bad in all races and cultures. From what I understand Philip was one of the good guys.

Perhaps messages of support for the mother that had to identify her son would be more appropriate or to the brothers that were once 5 and will now always be 4.

Those that throw stones should pray that they never have to defend their son's or daughters against accusations.

For the family - I am sorry for your loss and may Phillip be at peace and watch over you and yours.

Best wishes

One thing.. I can absolutely assure you the majority of youths being killed ARE NOT black, as someone said. It just so happens, for whatever reason, this is what the media tends to focus on in terms of violent crime. It seems like every day, theres another case Trident are covering, and then you never hear about it again. Whereas in the case of a white victim, it dominates the news for weeks and weeks. Think about the percentages of white and black people living in london, let alone england. How can u say its a 'black thing'.. literally and practically it makes no sense. Despite this, race shouldnt be an issue in the way the case and the victim is regarded. Just because he was black and just because he was sitting in a parked car with friends, it in no way implies he was part of a gang. Would you assume the same of a white man? I knew of Philip.. he wasnt a trouble maker, from the evidence coming to light it seems he was shot by somalians because he answered to living in peckham, nothing more and nothing less. That is what we're dealing with here

Anon wrote:
Only cowards carry guns and join gangs because there too scared to start trouble alone, Gangs are like a herd of sheep, The game follow my leader springs to mind. Im glad i left that all behind at nursery school lol

Exactly.

God bless u rest in peace my thoughts are with your family and friends who will miss u so much

WAS PHILLIP GOING ON A MURDER CHARGE? WHAT IM HEARING FROM PEOPLE IN PECKHAM IS THAT IT WAS A SET UP. I DONT KNOW. R.I.P KID

Ben wrote:
According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

Do you even know whatyour saying? do you even know this guy?,i was gud friends with phillip, such a kul guy! went cllege with him and he had just started uni .. ''u say according to london tonight'' phillip was from peckham had nuffin to do with all this pathetic gang war u seem to know so much about! Phillip was INNOCENT!

Ben wrote:

Me wrote: Dear Mr G.Brown, it\'s good to see that you have your priorites right. Tax everyone up to the eyelids and turn a blind eye to all the innocent people that are being knifed and shot at the moment. Thanks very much. A citizen of crime ridden London.

I don\'t think some of these people being murdered are exactly \'innocent\'. They obviously have mixed with people they shouldn\'t have to get themselves in the situation where they\'re being murdered. The one in Thamesmead and the Woman in New Cross where innocent victims, but these teenagers being murdered are most likely involved in Drugs and other dodgy dealings.

Do you know Phillip..No! Plz dont assume u do, claiming he is not innocent... like you know him.

Ben wrote:
According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

Phillip was a kul and humble boy.. ive read all the comments and im surprised on how well you think you all know him!.. claiming he must have been in a gang, had dodgy dealing and alla that..stereotypes made just because he is a black teen, its distgusting! He was an ambitous, clever funny guy who had just started uni, went college with him and he helped me with my gun and knife crime coursework in which he was very much anti guns and knifes. For those who assume about phillip ... Dont!, u dont know him! Ne 1 dat was lucky enough 2 know him will know dat he was innocent, wrong place wrong time!

Xx Rest in peace, Phillip Xx

I dont feel the police are to blame here. Like someone mentioned before, they are not mind readed. Imagine if they were to stop every suspious person they camne across no doubt they will play up to their racist cards.And accuse the police of being racist. Police follow the law and work extremly hard. Its the government that needs to bring in harder sentences. Youth these days are animals and i am ashamed to say things are only going to get worse. Next time you vote perhaps, remember how many people have lost their lives and what poor sentences their killer was given.Its up to us to make the change.

Gone 2 Soon..Rest in Peace wrote:

Ben wrote:
According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

Phillip was a kul and humble boy.. ive read all the comments and im surprised on how well you think you all know him!.. claiming he must have been in a gang, had dodgy dealing and alla that..stereotypes made just because he is a black teen, its distgusting! He was an ambitous, clever funny guy who had just started uni, went college with him and he helped me with my gun and knife crime coursework in which he was very much anti guns and knifes. For those who assume about phillip ... Dont!, u dont know him! Ne 1 dat was lucky enough 2 know him will know dat he was innocent, wrong place wrong time!

Xx Rest in peace, Phillip Xx

Since you know him in person, you know more then I do in regards to who he was and what he did. I wasn't trying to offend you or anyone who knew him, the assumptions made aren't disgusting, they're what 1st comes to mind when you look at the situation - 2 youths sitting in a car on a dodgy estate known for crime and gangs who's shot dead by a cold blooded killer. Yes it could well be mistaken identity or something similar, but people ask these questions because they're interested in what happened in a major incident in their local area. People want answers and solutions to stop this problem within the London area.

Bear in mind he was targetted for a reason and tragically shot dead. This doesn't just happen to random people, there has to be some reason behind it?

Does anyone know the guy Philip was with? Was this guy as nice as Philip was? Maybe it reaaly was as somebody stated the fact he was from Peckham - it's known 'Woolwich boys' have fueds with 'Peckham boys' along with another gang from Lewisham.

There's numerous reasons that people could delve into, but it's up to the police to do their job and reveal what actually happened.

R.I.P to Philip, if he was a nice guy it was tragic and sad the way his life was taken.

We'll await the answers to this case as time goes on...

ben from belvedere - get a life, every story i go on there you are having your say, arguing with everyone. go get a job and put your energy into it, maybe a pc as you have so many political criminal views....

Another black man dead on our streets by another group of black men.

The world as we know it is coming to an end and children in this day and age will not live to see past 21 if measures are not put in place to stop incidents like this from happening.

Who is allowing these guns and knives to be sold to these young men and why isn't the government taking precautions regarding these painful, sad incidents.

God will judge all and at the end of it, they will be punished for the pain and misery they have caused for all those families.

lk wrote:
ben from belvedere - get a life, every story i go on there you are having your say, arguing with everyone. go get a job and put your energy into it, maybe a pc as you have so many political criminal views....

Yes I have my say - is this not what the comment section is for you idiot?

As for arguing where is the arguement?! It's a discussion of opinions. Strange how nobody has picked up on the racist comments in this comment section along with the comment section regarding the murder in Thamesmead.

As for telling me to get a life and a job - do you even know me? I thought not. Why don't you spend less time following me and judging me from about 10 comments I've made and more time doing your own job. I have many views on alot of things, I've not been offensive to anyone so why don't you get off my back and mind your own business in rgeards to myself.

chiick frm souf wrote:
i actually knew philip and he was such a nice humble person. he never started unecessary problems wiv people he was actually tryin 2 do somethin positve with his life...most of da boys dat live in peckham r not doin anyfing wiv dere lives bt philip actually attented university...i know his whole family he has 4 brothers and i know that they are really grievein at the moment so yu ppl dat dnt kno him dnt **** on dis and say its abvious dat he was doin some sort of dodgy dealing because he wasnt he didnt deserve 2 die does somalians fink dat they run tings dwn in woolwich dats y alot of people do not like dem and dey want 2 hurt dem...all im saying is dat whoever did dis has made a very very big mistake becasue philip was very well known and respected in peckham so dere will be ppl dat want revenge...everyone shud b on guard because a war between woolwich/plumstaed sides and peckham sides has probably started because of dis tragedy RIP Philip Yu'll Neva B 4gotton G_xxx..

If he's not involved with gangs or violence why are you stating 'everyone should be on guard because a war between woolwich/plumstead sides and peckham sides has probably started because of this?'

Hypocrytical comments.

My fatherinlaw was held by gunpoint on eynsham drive 2 weeks a go , a man stab on ampleforth road abbeywood as well , i just hope this all stops soon .I think the hole area is getting bad now .

I am his brother
I have nothing to do but i will prayer for him

My thoughts go out to this boy's family but I have lived in the area for over 30 years and we have had our problems but it's definitely all the people that are being let into this country that are helping to cause more and more problems - what is going on, i am now in the minority when getting my bus, getting my train - it is not right. They have said in the paper this morning there is possibility the shooting in Plumstead was a Somalian gang - what are they doing in this country and how are they being allowed to buy guns. I am not racist I just see what is going on around me and I dont like it.

Agree with DD.

chiick frm souf: Are you suggesting more people could be killed because of this incident??

This is what I meant in my comments earlier about the way youths speak! Wars? Everyone should be on guard?? WTF?

Why.................
....................
.........?

When I spoke with a senior officer of Operation Trident a few weeks ago, he told me that among other reasons for black on black violent crime in the UK, one major reason for this violence is that many young people are desensitized and so taking the life of another person for as trivial an issue as"disrespect" is,if I may use my own words, "no big deal".
Question: How many young people have been killed by knife or gun crime this year? The last time I counted it was 21. Now, I've lost count.
Is there a possibility that it is not only the youths involved in these crimes that are desensitized to violence and murder? Is it possible that even the society at large including the government who should ensure the safety and security of its tax paying citizens, have also gradually become desensitized to violent crime among young people? Perhaps this explains why nothing practical and meaningful is being done to STOP these senseless killings!

Dom wrote:
Poor lad. RIP. To be honest I have lost count of how many youths lives have been lost this year in London, due to stabbings and shootings. My sister is 14 and my cousin is 6, and I don\\\'t want them growing up with this violence all around them. It has got to stop NOW!

Yo Phil, we all gonna miss u. U wer loved n i hope u knew dat. Im so sad ur gone coz u dont deserve it, wrong place at wrong time 4 real n u payed da worst price. Phil u gonna b in ery1z memorys n so is ur fam. Each n ery man has shed a tear and it aint gonna stop. 1

So many of these comments are based on hearsay, just because you hear something on the news or read it in a paper doesn't mean it's the truth, the whole truth and nowt else. In certain situations the issue of race is relevant, as is the lack of employment of these young people, their not achieving anything in our education system. Society as a whole needs to work together to right this awful situation. But so many of us are so easily influenced. How many of us really know the people around us, how many parents really know where there teenagers are? I'll be honest I don't have 100% faith in the police and I'm not alone, this itself makes the situation worse. Who can we trust, who can our children trust. Violence begets violence. There is no simple way to solve these problems, but communities need to start to work together and with other parties or parts of this country will become no go zones. It will be hard work who is willing to stand up and be counted and say I'm willing to try to change things. It takes a lot of guts to put yourself out there which is why so few of us do.

Ben wrote:
According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

Ben needs to be banned from writing vast amounts of hot air about what he knows little about. If he truly got this information from London tonight, then it is misinformation. If it is a gang related incident, then Philip was from none of the mentioned areas... I think this makes him innocent enough for people to pitty his loss. Not everyone who is caught up or whose life is taken is actually directly linked to gangs. People should get their facts straight, particular the news providers. Ben, ignorance is not your fault. I only pray Philips poor mum doesn't read your defirmation of her late son's character through your narrow minded views.

K, from Abbey Wood states that he/she was at the hospital when this boy was taken in and that the gang members where there and started trouble. Unless K from Abbey Wood is lying surely this means that this innocent boy was part of a gang. However other comments say he was anti- gangs, violence & guns. 2 very different stories! Someone I knew was recently killed, he was NOT a good person but you would have thought he was a saint the comments people made about him after he died in a car accident, which by the way was caused becuase he was drunk and out of his face on drugs.

Bev wrote:

Ben wrote:
According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

Ben needs to be banned from writing vast amounts of hot air about what he knows little about. If he truly got this information from London tonight, then it is misinformation. If it is a gang related incident, then Philip was from none of the mentioned areas... I think this makes him innocent enough for people to pitty his loss. Not everyone who is caught up or whose life is taken is actually directly linked to gangs. People should get their facts straight, particular the news providers. Ben, ignorance is not your fault. I only pray Philips poor mum doesn't read your defirmation of her late son's character through your narrow minded views.

It's been said the murderer was of Somalian decent of which the gangs in Woowlich predominantly are. It was also said on the news there has been trouble on that estate from gangs in the area mentioned.

DD wrote:

chiick frm souf wrote: i actually knew philip and he was such a nice humble person. he never started unecessary problems wiv people he was actually tryin 2 do somethin positve with his life...most of da boys dat live in peckham r not doin anyfing wiv dere lives bt philip actually attented university...i know his whole family he has 4 brothers and i know that they are really grievein at the moment so yu ppl dat dnt kno him dnt **** on dis and say its abvious dat he was doin some sort of dodgy dealing because he wasnt he didnt deserve 2 die does somalians fink dat they run tings dwn in woolwich dats y alot of people do not like dem and dey want 2 hurt dem...all im saying is dat whoever did dis has made a very very big mistake becasue philip was very well known and respected in peckham so dere will be ppl dat want revenge...everyone shud b on guard because a war between woolwich/plumstaed sides and peckham sides has probably started because of dis tragedy RIP Philip Yu\'ll Neva B 4gotton G_xxx..

If he\'s not involved with gangs or violence why are you stating \'everyone should be on guard because a war between woolwich/plumstead sides and peckham sides has probably started because of this?\' Hypocrytical comments.

Philip was not involved in gangs, but every other teen is a gang memeber these days. I would just like to say on behalf of Phil and his family and as a memeber of this family that WE DO NOT WANT NO STREET JUSTICE. REVENGE IS GOD'S!!! The police need to do what they can to resolve this matter. I don't think chiick frm souf new Phil and his peeps as well as she thinks. Honour Philips humble manner by stopping this madness now. THERE WILL BE NO WAR IN PHILIPS NAME. LET HIM R.I.P

This is not gang related, he was not involved in any of those activities, just because he lived in Peckham does not mean he is the stereotype that has plagued black young men.

Will this end here? I doubt it, those who have committed this crime will have to answer to someone...

RIP Phillip... the whole of Peckham is with the family.

Passer by wrote:

Bev wrote:

Ben wrote: According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

Ben needs to be banned from writing vast amounts of hot air about what he knows little about. If he truly got this information from London tonight, then it is misinformation. If it is a gang related incident, then Philip was from none of the mentioned areas... I think this makes him innocent enough for people to pitty his loss. Not everyone who is caught up or whose life is taken is actually directly linked to gangs. People should get their facts straight, particular the news providers. Ben, ignorance is not your fault. I only pray Philips poor mum doesn\'t read your defirmation of her late son\'s character through your narrow minded views.

It\'s been said the murderer was of Somalian decent of which the gangs in Woowlich predominantly are. It was also said on the news there has been trouble on that estate from gangs in the area mentioned.

What has this got to do with the fact that Philip was innocent and not from Woolwich. Ben claims he definately was not innocent!! I'm telling you he was innocent.

R.I.P Phil i didnt really know philip but when i did meet him he was such a nice person. When i heard the news i was shocked because he was an nice innocent boy who worked hard to make he's family proud. Philip wasn't like the gangs and guns related sort of person. i really feel for he's family and friends because they have known him for longer than i have but i still feel upset about his loss. R.I.P Phil

I'm unsure why my commnts have been singled out as it seems others have said similar to myself.

Like I said before I'm sorry if I offende anyone but I was repeated stuff I'd heard on the news.

It said the estate he was kille on has suffered from gang violence, so chances are the killers are from a gang. So therefore that makes this case associated potentially with gang crime does it not?

I'm not saying Philip was in a gang, but his killers could well have been.

The London Tonight clip is below for anyone who'd like to listen/watch it.

http://www.itvlocal.
com/london/news/?pla
yer=LON_Home_26&void
=108325

My appologies to anyone offended.

Bev wrote:

Passer by wrote:

Bev wrote:

Ben wrote: According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

Ben needs to be banned from writing vast amounts of hot air about what he knows little about. If he truly got this information from London tonight, then it is misinformation. If it is a gang related incident, then Philip was from none of the mentioned areas... I think this makes him innocent enough for people to pitty his loss. Not everyone who is caught up or whose life is taken is actually directly linked to gangs. People should get their facts straight, particular the news providers. Ben, ignorance is not your fault. I only pray Philips poor mum doesn\'t read your defirmation of her late son\'s character through your narrow minded views.

It\'s been said the murderer was of Somalian decent of which the gangs in Woowlich predominantly are. It was also said on the news there has been trouble on that estate from gangs in the area mentioned.

What has this got to do with the fact that Philip was innocent and not from Woolwich. Ben claims he definately was not innocent!! I'm telling you he was innocent.

Because it mentions the gang crime on the estate in the report on London Tonight.

I didn't say he 'deffinately wasn't innocent'. I said the people involved!

Bexley Mum wrote:
K, from Abbey Wood states that he/she was at the hospital when this boy was taken in and that the gang members where there and started trouble. Unless K from Abbey Wood is lying surely this means that this innocent boy was part of a gang. However other comments say he was anti- gangs, violence & guns. 2 very different stories! Someone I knew was recently killed, he was NOT a good person but you would have thought he was a saint the comments people made about him after he died in a car accident, which by the way was caused becuase he was drunk and out of his face on drugs.

Ask me no questions and I'll tell you no lies! Philip may have known gang members and a few wayward members may even be involved in gangs. Now if they decided to turn up at the hospital to try and avenge Philip in some twisted act of loyalty, then that should not be counted on Philip. One of my brothers is highly academic and successful in his career and the other is in prison on drug related charges. If anything was to happen to the academic one, the "gang related" one will react the way he knows how. My point is that how can you judge poor Philip by the actions of other people. PHILIP HAD NO INTERESTED IN GANGS AND GUNS. He was however, loved by many, including those who chose street life. Please stop painting this wonderful, wonderful young man with a stereotypical brush. Bexley mum is right there are to sides to the story. Philips anti-gang stance is the true story!!

It seems as though whether Philip was in a gang or not this gang retaliation will carry on, as Bev said chic from the south doesn't seem to know him at all, and is suggesting revenge. It seems as though people will take it upon themselves to fight in someone else's name, even though they don't know them.

thanks for the site ben - "The London Tonight clip is below for anyone who'd like to listen/watch it.

http://www.itvlocal.

com/london/news/?pla

yer=LON_Home_26&void

=108325....

but it's not recognised.... any suggestions?

http://www.itvlocal.
com/london/news/?pla
yer=LON_Home_26&void
=108325

The link posted is broken up on the comment just copy it in bits and paste together it works fine.

lk wrote:
thanks for the site ben - \"The London Tonight clip is below for anyone who\'d like to listen/watch it.

http://www.itvlocal.

com/london/news/?pla

yer=LON_Home_26&void

=108325....

but it\'s not recognised.... any suggestions?

Go to www.itvlocal.com/
got to the london news section (London tonight) and search for woolwich. The shooting video report comes up at the top.

I wouldn't believe too much of what ITV Local or the local BBC for that matter has to say. Regional journalism is rubbish, they cover such a wide area that they haven't got a clue what goes on in the local towns. I mean, they wrongly say it happened in Woolwich rather than Plumstead which shows they don't know what they're doing.

It looks like they sent their reporter down there for about five minutes. Then they sensationalise it with the cliched 'gang warefare' tag. Their report certainly makes it look like they jumped to conclusions pretty quick purely based on what that young mum told them as she walked by.

I'd much rather read proper local news on a proper local news site, and also get the views of propoer local people. At least the local papers know what's going on in their areas - and can at least get the names of the towns right!

Philip wasn't there for anything dodgy. H e was picking up one of his friends who lives there. If he had gone there for something else then how come the police didn't find any weapons or drugs in the car? If he was going out of his own turf to start trouble then why wasn't he armed? He was from Peckham and not invoved in the LOCAL rifts. I last saw him on Thursday at a party in Watford. He had a big personality and was trying to get a decent education.

My heart goes out to Philip. He was in my Media Class and group for 2 years. In our 2nd year we made a music video 2gether for our project.

May your Soul Rest In Perfect Peace Phil.

Dexter x

lk wrote:
ben from belvedere - get a life, every story i go on there you are having your say, arguing with everyone. go get a job and put your energy into it, maybe a pc as you have so many political criminal views....

Well said! Got too much to say for himself.




I AM NOT BEING RACIST IT'S THE TRUTH!!!!!

Thanks Tony Blair. Nice legacy you left, letting all these immigrants in, crime has shot up.

KICK 'EM OUT!

What people need to realise - no matter how terrifying it is - is that things like this DO happen to innocent people, for no apparent reason. It seems thats the reality of South East London today. Instead of trying to pacify the situation with 'he was probably in a gang', or 'he must have been involved in something dodgy', we need to look at the situation for what is it.. we've lost another strong beautiful black man over turf war; he got dragged into it through no fault of his own, and it was a war he wasnt even involved in. R.I.P. Philip those who knew you are mourning your death, we truly have lost someone special

STOP BLAMING US SOMALIANS FOR THINGS HAPPENING IN WOOLWICH

i knew phillip.. we went 2 primary school together and it fills me with sorrow to know that someone i knew died like this.. police need to do more to keep youths off the streets and doing something postive.... R.I.P phillip

It was definitely 2 somalians that pulled the trigger. That is 110% guaranteed. I knew both persons shot. R.I.P Phillip.

Dear Writer,

I am not upset with you comment “I don't think some of these people being murdered are exactly 'innocent'. They obviously have mixed with people they shouldn't have to get themselves in the situation where they're being”
Prior to Sunday I may have had that notion in mind that somehow somewhere how possible would it be that an innocent person/people are targeted killed and injured (Gunned or stabbed) I held that view until Sunday evening.
I write not as a family member but more as a Londoner just as you and a resident of South London (as you maybe? am guessing).
These are not gangsters, “rude boys” but they are simply young men and in actual fact university students. If we base all responses, suggestions, on facts rather than conjecture. I was fortunate to have been in the company of Philip and can assure you he was a young man who had ambitions, dreams & drive.
If and when we have prejudgments it surely does not help and I am now possibly open to the reality that many similar incidents take place daily, weekly and they are not seriously investigated nor adequate resources are scaled to bringing the perpetrators of such nonsensical violence to justice and in a sense bring some solace and at some closure to the families affected that justice has served its cause.
I will use the example of me as it is the easiest thing I am a university graduate (I will be the first to say that does not make me special or smarter). I have worked as a teacher and have been fortunate to have had various key opportunities with education in my relevant short career to date. I have dedicated my life to Education and to be specific Adult Education. That has seen me working within Further, Private, Voluntary, & presently within Community Education. I am have recently decided to take my Master which is in Education and International Development but let me not bore you with my life history if I had been at Thamsmead with my friends (a doctor, a trainee accountant or whoever….) waiting for a friend as oppose to my brother and his friends would that mean we are suddenly a gang member or gangsters?

Personally I think classifying crime with race is a serious flaws as crime is crime irrespective of race. Yes lately the increase in what is commonly classified as black on black crimes would be better detaching race to the crime to flag the point even clearly if that incident on Sunday we had victims being a group of three young white men waiting for a friend in car would you even consider/think “Oh maybe they were gang members” I will answer that for you the answer is simply NO we would be reviewing the magnitude of the tragedy on a Nationally level and looking at how measures of ensuring this will never happens again.

Government and law makers must not forget the first responsibility is to citizens as presently the unfortunate realty is people just do not feel safe. The shift where resources are spent in trying to understand why criminals’ are crimes and ignoring the victims of crime is something that cannot continue. Rights campaigners I ask what words do would you have to console a mother who has lost a son as Philip before campaigning for all the rights for criminals.
Londoners are constantly living in fear and many people are taking an exodus from this great capital as people just do not simply feel safe. Lastly police need to be given the powers be able to police effectively with limited red tape the over reliance on office based remote policing more time writing reports than chasing and investigating crime a symbol of the bureaucracy cancer that is infesting all areas of public service at surely an added costs and a disservice to tax payers. When arming police with powers of which I support they must not be powers which are easily open to police abuse and victimization such as SAS laws were.

Tougher sentencing for people who choose to carry knives or guns will surely show some commitment to fighting the potential would be killers as the law as it stands now is simply motivates gang member and lost young people to feel that they need to carry knives or guns for self protection which surely is the job for the law and the police to protect citizens not vigilantism.

Having labels as we presently do on crime (black on black crime) has meant that they are just numbers we attach i.e. the 23 young person and ending with now the common label trident are investigating the incident awaiting for the number 24th to unfortunately happen in a few hours weeks or months. I ask as a society what does that tell us about ourselves as people.

I end by commending the Mr Gabriel Komolafe who helped and prayed for Philip and my brother on the road side by offering a touch of humanity when it was so needed my family are deeply grateful to you. The doctor, nurse at Queen Elizabeth hospital saying thanks for your efforts is just not enough. The officers who guarded my brother’s safety we are grateful. To all family and friends of both families thanks you for you immediate support but that is just the beginning….
The lost young men who so carelessly took my brother best friend’s life and leaving a family with a hole by losing a much loved son. I pray that I/We can find the strength within us to forgive you. We are grieving forgiveness seems so far away Yesterday & Today we are hurting and are under immense pain and it’s hard I admit but I know we must pray for you and forgive you and will pray for strength and wisdom.

doesnt matter if your black, white or asian people always assume the worst of people. If your a young person in this day and age you are stereotypically tarred with the same brush no matter how you behave, because statistically it is young people committing these terrible crimes.
If he was a 40 year old man white or black would people assume he was in a gang or drug dealing? No, but an 18yr old is he in a gang or up to no good? "he must be"
This attitude needs to change.
Innocent til proven guilty.

Ben wrote:

Me wrote: Dear Mr G.Brown, it\'s good to see that you have your priorites right. Tax everyone up to the eyelids and turn a blind eye to all the innocent people that are being knifed and shot at the moment. Thanks very much. A citizen of crime ridden London.

I don\'t think some of these people being murdered are exactly \'innocent\'. They obviously have mixed with people they shouldn\'t have to get themselves in the situation where they\'re being murdered. The one in Thamesmead and the Woman in New Cross where innocent victims, but these teenagers being murdered are most likely involved in Drugs and other dodgy dealings.

Don't make assumpions or stereotype, how do you know it wasn't mistaken identity? Don't be so ignorant and just assume cause its teenager they aren't innocent

I live on woolwich commen esate and i wonder what has happened recently where there are groups of about 30 boys mostly somalians just hanging around. I am black so this isn't a race thing but it angers, disturbs me to see this day in and day out. idle hands !! Get a job, Education. I am single person bringing up my child with morals and respect . i also work full time and yes life can be hard but life can be sometimes , guess what i deal with it.
The powers that be have given you the tools to kill each other over powder or pills and paper and you fools play right into their hands. Most people on that estate are drug fuelled wit no respect for life or anyone else. If you want to kill each other do it away from decent good citizens. But know that there is a consequence for your actions. PARENTS wake up and smell the coffee, when your child comes in at three in the morning or as a student has more money than he should have, or is pushing a heavy car, you stay there and close your eyes to thi. Your the same ones to say my son/daughter was a good boy or girl. No their not and you know it. Ignorance is no excuse. YOU THAT CARRIES THE GUN MAY FEEL YOU HOLD THE POWER BUT AFTER YOU HAVE MAIMED AND MURERED KNOW THAT YOUR CONSEQUENCE IS AROUND THE CORNER !!! IT'S JUST A MATTER OF TIME.

Anon wrote:

INFO wrote: the person killed was not from the area and the killers are not local people or local gang. one more thing, the person killed has ...... before. RIP

Any how do you know all this ? The mind boggles !

This government has let so many immigrants who bring their cultures with them. Bring back the death penalty and arm our police. This country is seen as a pushover for entry. Most of these individiuals are here illegally borrowing each others NI nos. Bring in ID cards and introduce the death sentence. Tighten our borders.

Tasha wrote:
This place is becoming more disgraceful by the day, and i am starting to become embarressed to say that i am from england. I grew up in abbeywood, a town that many people loved to live in. now it is the complete opposite and that is why me and my family moved out. i cannot believe how much the area has changed in recent years! Am i the only one who thinks that there may be a connection between the rise in immigration and the rise in crime? i am not saying that this is the reason but many members of these so called \'gangs\' originate, or their family originate from more violent countries. could it be that they are bringing this violence with them as this is the type of environment that they know? It seems that youths pick up on this behaviour and start to follow it as they think it will earn them respect. as i say, i am not implying that this is the cause so i don\'t want people to twist my words and make out that i am being racist because that is not what i am saying at all. I just can\'t help but think there may be a connection and the government needs to do something about it so we can all live in a town that we are not scared to walk around in!!!

100% agree. Why should I be in the minority somewhere where I have lived for so many years. Most of these immigrants are so rude and arrogant its awful. They just have no respect.

The shock of Phillips death has yet to really settle into his familys hearts. Each day that they wake up a steam train will be hitting them in their heart (thats if they are sleeping at all.)

The comments seem to have become more accepting of Phillips inocence.

Which teenager has not sat in a car with his friends, it was not late at night it was an evening. Which 18 year old is tucked up in bed with his co coa at 11pm?

When you live in areas such as these many young men know of gang members, many probably went to infants, junior or senior schools with some of them. But young men like Philip choose not to join them, they tip toe around the trouble getting on with their lives. Philip was not in need of a gang family, he has a strong and supporting family that loved him deeply.

He had friends with ambition and had ambition himself to make a better life for himself.

The full truth will come out, the murderers were intent on killing and they have taken a life of worth.

I hope they are caught, I hope they are punished, there is a long road for Philip's family to take and they are still in week 1. Support them with your good wishes, do not make then feel that they have to defend their son from comments from people that did not have the pleasure of knowing him.

Philip cannot defend himself, someone of no worth took that option away from him.

many live have been taking and we need to stand up to our right becouse people can not get killed and the polic should please take action of what have happen may his soul rest in peace AMEAN...............
....................
...............

I am a first cousin to the victim.Unfortunately we never met because the family went in different directions.I feel cheated.I feel denied of the experience of meeting him.right now I am crying for what he lost, what we have all lost as his family.this is a painful moment for the family and friends.For all those whose prayers are with us...I say thank you.For all those assumptions being made that he was doing drugs and crime, Phillip is not here so he cannot defend himself.
That doesn't mean he has no one that loves him or believes in him...Innocent people also get shot.He is not a statistic to us.Phillipo, May God grant you peace as you rest....my heart still bleeds.I LOVE YOU..I LOVE YOU

Keji, I feel for your loss but I sont think any of these comments are actually personal to the victim. You may or may not have heard that another youngster was shot in the north of the country yesterday. These comments are just ordinary people trying to make sense of a situation that our government really just doesnt know how to solve. There are a lot of varied and quite justifiable comments on this thread. I envy you if you are indeed in Canada as this country has gone blame crazy. Blame is always shifted from the guilty in this place. Just look at that kid that teenager that swallowed a pen lid and died. His school has banned pen lids and the parents are pressing for a natioanl ban. Ridiculous. Of course, the deceased wasnt to blame for the 'accident' it has to be the pen lid for existing. This example has nothing to do with this story, just the crazy, stupid country I live in.

I'm tempted to jump ship and leave it to the immigrants.

This area is getting crazy, bout revenge now 1 shots 1 so they have to get back and shot some1 else but they are killing innocent peeps. i used to walk around woolwich when i was 15 not a care in the world now i fear for my family and myself and weather i may getting a fone call telling me that it's happen to someone i no!!!! and there are murders that have been all over the papers we anit aware of half the **** that goes on these days 22 teenagers and the rest!!

Ben wrote:
According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

I knew this guy and he was a close friend of mine. He did not live and was not involved in gangs from thamesmead, woolich or charlton. He was someone victimized by individuals form these gangs because of their fueds with one other. He did not deserve to die and was innocent .

INFO wrote:
the person killed was not from the area and the killers are not local people or local gang. one more thing, the person killed has ...... before. RIP

What are you trying to say make it clear so i can understand you. Wha has he done before?

Andy wrote:
It is pretty obvious that this is either gang or drug related, people dont just shoot people for no reason why there are sitting in thier car!! I know this country is ridden with knife and gun crime, govenment are just not getting to grips with the problem, they talk good, but no actions to deal with it... I make a prediection that within the next month at least 2 more people will be murdered in south london / Kent!! Its that predicable now, lets hope it isnt somebody we care about!!

it was not gang or drug related, they knew someone who lived on the estate and went to pick them up. Why do people love to assume the worst in people. Just because 2 youths are sitting in a car it must be drug or gang related. Why dont you read up on what happened then you can start talking.

Ben wrote:
Excuse me but people don't get shot for nothing while sitting in their car - why were these 2 youths sitting in their car on a dodgy estate? Linking a girl you say? Well we'll find out after the police have taken statements and release more details yeah?

The assumption was made on legible grounds considering most people who are shot or are shooting themselves are related to gangs, and usually these incidents happen in areas where gangs are present such as this incident.

If you knew this boy like your message implies, then I'm sorry for you that he's been murdered. At 18 it's not what anyone wants somebody so young to go through. But you have to remember this is a 'comment' section on peoples opinions on this shooting, people are interested in what actually happened.

As for somebody going Uni it doesn't automatically make them innocent, some intelligent people still get caught up in things they shouldn't.

As for being brough up in an area where people sell drugs etc... I was... maybe not on my direct doorstep but not too far away. Luckily I moved away before I got drawn into anything major, and I know some people don't have that option.

I wasn't talking crap, I was making an opinionated assumption from what I've read, seen and heard on the local streets I've been brought up on.

If I offended you then sorry.

Your right no one gets shot for no reason, but in this case they shot him because of the place were he grew up in and for no other reason. it seems stupid but thats what happened.

Ben wrote:

Gone 2 Soon..Rest in Peace wrote:

Ben wrote:
According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

Phillip was a kul and humble boy.. ive read all the comments and im surprised on how well you think you all know him!.. claiming he must have been in a gang, had dodgy dealing and alla that..stereotypes made just because he is a black teen, its distgusting! He was an ambitous, clever funny guy who had just started uni, went college with him and he helped me with my gun and knife crime coursework in which he was very much anti guns and knifes. For those who assume about phillip ... Dont!, u dont know him! Ne 1 dat was lucky enough 2 know him will know dat he was innocent, wrong place wrong time!

Xx Rest in peace, Phillip Xx

Since you know him in person, you know more then I do in regards to who he was and what he did. I wasn't trying to offend you or anyone who knew him, the assumptions made aren't disgusting, they're what 1st comes to mind when you look at the situation - 2 youths sitting in a car on a dodgy estate known for crime and gangs who's shot dead by a cold blooded killer. Yes it could well be mistaken identity or something similar, but people ask these questions because they're interested in what happened in a major incident in their local area. People want answers and solutions to stop this problem within the London area.

Bear in mind he was targetted for a reason and tragically shot dead. This doesn't just happen to random people, there has to be some reason behind it?

Does anyone know the guy Philip was with? Was this guy as nice as Philip was? Maybe it reaaly was as somebody stated the fact he was from Peckham - it's known 'Woolwich boys' have fueds with 'Peckham boys' along with another gang from Lewisham.

There's numerous reasons that people could delve into, but it's up to the police to do their job and reveal what actually happened.

R.I.P to Philip, if he was a nice guy it was tragic and sad the way his life was taken.

We'll await the answers to this case as time goes on...

i knew both phil and the other guy and i no that these people werent people to be involved in guns or knives. it was only a couple months ago we talking about our futures and what we were expecting to happen. im a bit tired of trying to defend my friends from people with stereotypical views. Just know that phil and the other guy were close friends of mine and were nice people withs goals.

Bexley Mum wrote:
K, from Abbey Wood states that he/she was at the hospital when this boy was taken in and that the gang members where there and started trouble. Unless K from Abbey Wood is lying surely this means that this innocent boy was part of a gang. However other comments say he was anti- gangs, violence & guns. 2 very different stories! Someone I knew was recently killed, he was NOT a good person but you would have thought he was a saint the comments people made about him after he died in a car accident, which by the way was caused becuase he was drunk and out of his face on drugs.

i was at the hospital at the time also, it was not a gang that was at that hospital it was group of boys who angered frustrated and curious and the scurity werent helping by talking down to us. Philip was not part of a gang he just had a lot of friends who cared about him!

Philip rest in peace!!

In our sorrow

In our sorrow how we wish that time would stand still
How we wish that the sun would rise from a different direction
How we wish that nothing remained the same
Because our very foundations are shaken
The fabric that held our sanity together ripped
What we see as the unfairness of others living on
Is the very salvation for our shattered hearts
And our pain at the injustice of our losses
……….it wakes us up
We will journey on…..though we will never forget our fallen ones or have an answer to the question why it happened.
R.I.P Phillipo Poru , with love, your cousin Keji

Philip Poru is from a good guys in the world.
people said philip poru is died in the wrong place, time that is true.
Why if some one killed by gun shot people saying he is a bad person ?
Philip is a goood person.
why is good guys died young ?
Philip is gone.
I need answer for my 2 questions ?
rest in peace....

I think that we should let them all kill each other coz thats what they are doing already!!! Its sad sum 1 has been killed but thats life **** happens. There is more crime now than ten years ago coz our goverment have been so thick and let to many people in to this country they cant even look after the people that live here let alone let more in!!! Thats why the country is in such a mess i blame the goverment and the parents to some point. Bring back National Service and let all the f***ers go in there blk/wht/chin/ind and if they wanna kill each other let them. All this gang on gang there wasnt so much of this ten years ago im not saying it didnt go on coz it did but its worse now why?Coz there is to many people here to many diffrent nationalitys that cant get on yet forget that in there own countrys people are killing people over nothing and they come here to get away from it yet think its ok to take a life well its not and if they feel like that send them back.

I could not agree more with Lala's comments, its an absolute disgrace that people are acting in this manner. Woolwich is well bad now, all the gangs hanging around the estates and then causing trouble. Its not safe to walk out your door and as we have seen not safe to sit in a car. When these murderers are caught, they should convict them and their family should be punished (i.e deported). If the government took more of a stiffer stance against crime i.e. if you are convicted of a crime, your family should also pay for the crime. Maybe if something like that were in place, parents would be tougher with their kids, kids would be more responsible and maybe we would not have to read news telling us another person has been killed.

Unknown wrote:

Dom wrote:
Poor lad. RIP. To be honest I have lost count of how many youths lives have been lost this year in London, due to stabbings and shootings. My sister is 14 and my cousin is 6, and I don\\\\\\\'t want them growing up with this violence all around them. It has got to stop NOW!

Yo Phil, we all gonna miss u. U wer loved n i hope u knew dat. Im so sad ur gone coz u dont deserve it, wrong place at wrong time 4 real n u payed da worst price. Phil u gonna b in ery1z memorys n so is ur fam. Each n ery man has shed a tear and it aint gonna stop. 1

I envy you.I never got to meet him.Never got the chance to talk.now its too late the tears cannot stop.our family has lost him too soon.It means a lot to me that I can release some of my pain here.It hurts so bad especially coz I am not near my family at this trying moment.Thank you for the support

Concerned well wisher wrote:
An 18 year old young man has had his life halted. His parents will never meet his children, his brothers will never stand next to him at his wedding. He will not attend his graduation.......... ..... The above comments from people include so many assumptions, why is it that if a black teenager is killed the first thing their family and friends have to defend is whether they are in a gang or not. Perhaps Phillip was in the wrong place at the wrong time, until I know other wise I will give the benefit of doubt. There are good and bad in all races and cultures. From what I understand Philip was one of the good guys. Perhaps messages of support for the mother that had to identify her son would be more appropriate or to the brothers that were once 5 and will now always be 4. Those that throw stones should pray that they never have to defend their son's or daughters against accusations. For the family - I am sorry for your loss and may Phillip be at peace and watch over you and yours. Best wishes

Very well said.

There are good and bad in all races.

Let this mans family grieve in peace.

Yonnie Shivalila wrote:
Dear Writer,

I am not upset with you comment “I don\'t think some of these people being murdered are exactly \'innocent\'. They obviously have mixed with people they shouldn\'t have to get themselves in the situation where they\'re being”
Prior to Sunday I may have had that notion in mind that somehow somewhere how possible would it be that an innocent person/people are targeted killed and injured (Gunned or stabbed) I held that view until Sunday evening.
I write not as a family member but more as a Londoner just as you and a resident of South London (as you maybe? am guessing).
These are not gangsters, “rude boys” but they are simply young men and in actual fact university students. If we base all responses, suggestions, on facts rather than conjecture. I was fortunate to have been in the company of Philip and can assure you he was a young man who had ambitions, dreams & drive.
If and when we have prejudgments it surely does not help and I am now possibly open to the reality that many similar incidents take place daily, weekly and they are not seriously investigated nor adequate resources are scaled to bringing the perpetrators of such nonsensical violence to justice and in a sense bring some solace and at some closure to the families affected that justice has served its cause.
I will use the example of me as it is the easiest thing I am a university graduate (I will be the first to say that does not make me special or smarter). I have worked as a teacher and have been fortunate to have had various key opportunities with education in my relevant short career to date. I have dedicated my life to Education and to be specific Adult Education. That has seen me working within Further, Private, Voluntary, & presently within Community Education. I am have recently decided to take my Master which is in Education and International Development but let me not bore you with my life history if I had been at Thamsmead with my friends (a doctor, a trainee accountant or whoever….) waiting for a friend as oppose to my brother and his friends would that mean we are suddenly a gang member or gangsters?

Personally I think classifying crime with race is a serious flaws as crime is crime irrespective of race. Yes lately the increase in what is commonly classified as black on black crimes would be better detaching race to the crime to flag the point even clearly if that incident on Sunday we had victims being a group of three young white men waiting for a friend in car would you even consider/think “Oh maybe they were gang members” I will answer that for you the answer is simply NO we would be reviewing the magnitude of the tragedy on a Nationally level and looking at how measures of ensuring this will never happens again.

Government and law makers must not forget the first responsibility is to citizens as presently the unfortunate realty is people just do not feel safe. The shift where resources are spent in trying to understand why criminals’ are crimes and ignoring the victims of crime is something that cannot continue. Rights campaigners I ask what words do would you have to console a mother who has lost a son as Philip before campaigning for all the rights for criminals.
Londoners are constantly living in fear and many people are taking an exodus from this great capital as people just do not simply feel safe. Lastly police need to be given the powers be able to police effectively with limited red tape the over reliance on office based remote policing more time writing reports than chasing and investigating crime a symbol of the bureaucracy cancer that is infesting all areas of public service at surely an added costs and a disservice to tax payers. When arming police with powers of which I support they must not be powers which are easily open to police abuse and victimization such as SAS laws were.

Tougher sentencing for people who choose to carry knives or guns will surely show some commitment to fighting the potential would be killers as the law as it stands now is simply motivates gang member and lost young people to feel that they need to carry knives or guns for self protection which surely is the job for the law and the police to protect citizens not vigilantism.

Having labels as we presently do on crime (black on black crime) has meant that they are just numbers we attach i.e. the 23 young person and ending with now the common label trident are investigating the incident awaiting for the number 24th to unfortunately happen in a few hours weeks or months. I ask as a society what does that tell us about ourselves as people.

I end by commending the Mr Gabriel Komolafe who helped and prayed for Philip and my brother on the road side by offering a touch of humanity when it was so needed my family are deeply grateful to you. The doctor, nurse at Queen Elizabeth hospital saying thanks for your efforts is just not enough. The officers who guarded my brother’s safety we are grateful. To all family and friends of both families thanks you for you immediate support but that is just the beginning….
The lost young men who so carelessly took my brother best friend’s life and leaving a family with a hole by losing a much loved son. I pray that I/We can find the strength within us to forgive you. We are grieving forgiveness seems so far away Yesterday & Today we are hurting and are under immense pain and it’s hard I admit but I know we must pray for you and forgive you and will pray for strength and wisdom.

thank you for your kind words.they are a source of comfort.Our Phillipo is gone.I hope your brother recovers quickly and may we never have to go through this ever again

Again..more gang-related crap....I went out last night..bout 9pm and what do i see at woolwich arsenal?? an ambulance..about 4 police cars..train station closed..traffic stopped....all because of some stupidness between the somalian boys and some other gang...when is all this going to stop??although i have no fear for myself...what about the innocent people that get caught up in this because they are in the wrong place at the wrong time??...when will these young boys and girls realise that they are worht so much more to us alive than dead?? they are our future and right now the future aint looking too good....I was never allowed to roam the streets like these kids are...i would have got a slap if i was like this....dont get me wrong..my family isn't perfect..but we have had no problems with gang stuff...these young kids need to be given a shrot sharp shock of some kind to make them realise that this is wrong...how would they feel if it was their child that got shot, stabbed etc...how would the parents of these kids feel??...what the hell are the parents doing while their kids are doing this?? and i have to say..its not just kids from disadvantaged backgrounds...its the posh ones with mummy n daddy and enough money....

*** wrote:

Bexley Mum wrote: K, from Abbey Wood states that he/she was at the hospital when this boy was taken in and that the gang members where there and started trouble. Unless K from Abbey Wood is lying surely this means that this innocent boy was part of a gang. However other comments say he was anti- gangs, violence & guns. 2 very different stories! Someone I knew was recently killed, he was NOT a good person but you would have thought he was a saint the comments people made about him after he died in a car accident, which by the way was caused becuase he was drunk and out of his face on drugs.

i was at the hospital at the time also, it was not a gang that was at that hospital it was group of boys who angered frustrated and curious and the scurity werent helping by talking down to us. Philip was not part of a gang he just had a lot of friends who cared about him!

"Talking down to us"
This is the problem - it's all about 'respect' with these stupid hooligans/gangsters - whatever you would refer to them as. Its all about an eye for an eye with these idiots. What happened to good old british values like holding your head up high and just carrying on. No - these idiots need revenge now for such stupid things as name calling "dissning your bredrin" or whatever these nobs want to call it.

If security ask people to stand back then its going to be for a reason. Why not just do as they say rather than cause a hoo-ha about it. That attitude represents a genuine lack of respect for authority

no one expects you to understand the level of emotion that Philip's family and friends feel b'coz of their loss so please dont try to ask why they were frustrated.holding my head up high when the life slips out of a loved one cannot happen.You expect them to hold their heads high and carry on? on the spot, as it happens??that is just so cold.But you know what....im glad Philip had people who felt deeply for him....such friends are the gifts that make life what it is.....you would never know what it is like to lose Philip coz to you he is a statistic.Its ok though, we shall overcome with time. I am getting sick and tired of justifying why I am in pain.guess you just took out the phrase and made your own conclusion out of it.PHILLIPO R.I.P, LOVE YOU LOTS

k wrote:
T-BLOCK consist of mainly african boys, same as CHERRY ORCHARD AND THE WOOLWICH BOYS ALL BLACK. i work in the hopsital where the dead boy was taken there was no respect from any of the gang members giving any imformation regarding the dead boy details so the hosp could inform his parents they got told that the gang members were his family, they had to section off the resuss dept where a&e were working on the dead boy cause the so called gang members were making so much trouble, we are in a hospital for god sake. my answer is YOU WANT TO RUN WITH A GANG AND MESS WITH GUNS & KNIVES COS U THINK IS COOL, THEN EXCEPT THE CONCEQUENCES. My son also got mugged by T BLOCK at the abbey ruins last year made of with a tenner, mobile phone, gold necklace and braclet. five of them hitting him in the head, iron bar whacked round his back with another one swinging a sword, scary yeah. for a seventeen year old.

The Woolwich boys are not black so if your are going to quote something get it right they are somalians, and violent at that. Have you never seen The Younger Woolwich Boys video on Youtube? and these are just youngers between 8-16 years old.

Somalians are black Africans, why do certain black people not like to be associated with Somalians being black?

To lable these animals as gangsters is to glorify them. Send them to the ghetto's of Jamaica,Brazil, Bronx. Let's see how bad they are then. This cannnot be a coincidence that in a borough where the majority of residents are Somalians this is happening. Of course this is a boiling pot for trouble what are you expected to get when you get a mix of unemployed, uneducated, unitergrated group of people constantly breeding. There are some decent Somalians trying to get by, there is a majority of them un-doing all their hard work making life much harder. A comment stating that black people don't associate themselves with Somalians is wrong , Somalians are not best known for their intergration skills , two sides to a coin. You people need to get jobs stop living off the state, stop breeding and take responsibility.
To the young man's family who lost his life, i pray in time your pain will heal, there will be an end to his madness.

Bring back corporal punishment. It's the only way! Life for life. Nothing else seems to work. They need to be scared, they know nothing will happen to them, they know they will get away with it. Even if they do get a custodial sentence, it doesn't seem a strong enough deterent. BRING BACK HANGING!!!!!

has nufffink 2 do wit tblock this is woolich boys nd peckham

Alison wrote:
Bring back corporal punishment. It's the only way! Life for life. Nothing else seems to work. They need to be scared, they know nothing will happen to them, they know they will get away with it. Even if they do get a custodial sentence, it doesn't seem a strong enough deterent. BRING BACK HANGING!!!!!

I make you right Alison they are never gonna learn other wise.The way they are going we will have no furture of today as they will all be dead within the next 10yrs.BRING BACK HANGING I SECOND THAT!!!!!

PHILIP REST IN PEACE , A LOT THAT I DO NOT AGREE WITH, BUT NEVERTHELESS, I KNEW PHILIP, WE WENT TO THE SAME COLLEGE AND I KNOW THAT AT THE END OF THE DAY, HE WAS A DEFINATELY A GOOD GUY ,I BELEIVE PHILIP WAS IN THE WRONG PLACE AT THE WRONG TIME, SITTING IN A CAR DOESN'T MEAN HE WAS IN A GANG OR SELLING DRUGS, MOST PROBLY PICKING SOMEONE UP OR AS QUOTED BEFORE "GOING ON A LINK" . THE SILLY THING IS MOST PEOPLE WON'T BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT ITS LIKE TO BE A YOUNG BLACK MALE IN AREAS SUCH AS THAMESMEAD, WOOLWICH, LEWISHAM, BRIXTON, AND SURROUNDING AREAS. ITS NOT EASY.THE ONLY HOPE MOST OF Y.B.M's HAVE IS TO MAKE IT TO UNI. WHICH IS STILL A STRUGGLE. I AS A 17 YEAR OLD LIVING IN SOUTHEAST LONDON KNOW WHAT ITS LIKE AND ITS NOT ALWAYS WHAT THE MEDIA MAKE IT OUT TO BE, THERE ARE THINGS THAT GO ON THAT THE MEDIA CHOOSE NOT TO BROADCAST SO IF YOU WANT TO MAKE AN EDUCATED OPINION, GET THE FACTS FOR YOURSELF AND TALK TO THOSE CLOSEST TO THE PEOPLE BEING KILLED.IN CONCLUSION WE ALL NEED TO ALL COME TOGETHER AS ONE AND STOP THIS MADNESS. GO BACK TO THE DAYS WHEN THE MOST THAT COULD HAPPEN WAS A FIST FIGHT BECAUSE IF WE CONTINUE WE'RE ONLY KILLING ARE BROTHERS AND SISTERS, AND EVEN POSSIBLY OUR FUTURE IF THIS WAY OF LIFE CONTINUES.

I'M SORRY FOR PHILIP'S FAMILIES LOSS.

ONCE AGAIN

R.I.P Phillip Poru,
I currently go college same as Mr.Bakare, i knew phillip , i also kno he was a GOODGUY he wasn't involved in anything to follow onto his death , he was meerly there to pick a friend up who lived there , he was killed coz he was in the wrong area at da wrong time , the killers mistakened him for an opposing area (i.e Thamesmead , Charlton) it scares me how this society is goin downhill , nd the government aint there to do nothin they're allowing this to happen becoz it brings more jobs in the hospitals and emergency services, nd the coroners must be having a field day with all these young black males being slain , all these teenagers dying they put it in the news jus to hav a story so that ppl at home can go aww what a shame , thats it!!! uno how many other deaths and incidents involving weopons are unmentioned in the media literally hundreds nd no actions come of this jus words they promise to do for the communities , until it hits home thats when they will wish to act , nd what i h8t is this wannabe gangster society!!!, its not BROOKLYN!! we all cant be 50 Cent or Scarface becoz they feel yeh thats the most important thing in life is money power and respect , no in this life its about making ur parents proud that we were born its about doin good for others making people smile , when u get good grades when u hav a well paid job in the inner city wearing a suit... not on the streets aimlessley standin there smoking weed , livin off benefits , still living with there mum at age of 19-25 , selling drugs goin in and out of jail or killing people to bring fear to others...nd the thing is these people get respect they get the women they're the people on everyones lips nd get mentioned like..."yeh yeh i know this person cause hes my cousin's frend and hes a leng man(bad person)he murdered someone" so what!!! i personally think them people should b looked down on they deserve no respect they're provin they are evilhearted and they are weak minded nd giv into these evil temptations.. what u dont think i couldn't go nd b the same i live in an a bad area nd i could go out nd start trouble nd i can but thats a lifestyle that i know is not worth it its too risky nd if u grew up in a good home even if its in a ruff area with brothers and sisters , with food on the table whats the need to bring more trouble to ur doorstep nd risk ur families lives aswell..
Phillip was far from these people im mentioning , he was pursuing his dream nd goin to University , he had a nice car , a girlfriend and a alot of friends and family who loved him so why is he a victim of these incidents? what did he do to deserve this? jus becoz he was in another area...im jus hoping whereever he is its better place than this melting pot called London.....R.I.P Phillip Poru nd my heart goes out to the Poru family

Dan wrote:

*** wrote:

Bexley Mum wrote: K, from Abbey Wood states that he/she was at the hospital when this boy was taken in and that the gang members where there and started trouble. Unless K from Abbey Wood is lying surely this means that this innocent boy was part of a gang. However other comments say he was anti- gangs, violence & guns. 2 very different stories! Someone I knew was recently killed, he was NOT a good person but you would have thought he was a saint the comments people made about him after he died in a car accident, which by the way was caused becuase he was drunk and out of his face on drugs.

i was at the hospital at the time also, it was not a gang that was at that hospital it was group of boys who angered frustrated and curious and the scurity werent helping by talking down to us. Philip was not part of a gang he just had a lot of friends who cared about him!

"Talking down to us"
This is the problem - it's all about 'respect' with these stupid hooligans/gangsters - whatever you would refer to them as. Its all about an eye for an eye with these idiots. What happened to good old british values like holding your head up high and just carrying on. No - these idiots need revenge now for such stupid things as name calling "dissning your bredrin" or whatever these nobs want to call it.

If security ask people to stand back then its going to be for a reason. Why not just do as they say rather than cause a hoo-ha about it. That attitude represents a genuine lack of respect for authority

At the end of the day we deserve to get treated with the same respect that you expect to be shown and if you think someone is allowed to talk to someone else like there crap just because there in a uniform, then your the one with a problem.

Wow i have read all your comments and it shocks me how some people can talk crap about someone they dont know.(U know who im referring to)

I ust wanna say R.I.P Phillip its a shame your life got cut short, but I believe God has called you now for a reason. It still seems so unreal, thank u for all the times i cut in front of u the canteen and all the pens i borrowed from u in LRC. It was a pleasure knowing you
My thoughts are with his family, May God be with you. R.I.P Phil

Darren wrote:
So what are two black geezers , doesnt matter where they are from, doing sitting in a ford fiesta in the middle of woolwich common estate? .

I was chopped by the same group some two weeks before and I can say this for sure what ever they were doing they did not deserve to be killed like dogs. go where it happened, it's dark and cold and those Somali boys are out of hand and they and there families should be deported for there crimes. they are weak individuals who behave like animals who now no better.

quote

Ive read most of ur comments and its shocking to see that ppl who have never seen phillip in their life have so much **** to say about him. Dont you think in this time of tragedy you should be offering condolences to his family and friends instead of accusing him of being up to no gud. As a friend of Phil it annoys me to read this crap and I only knew him for 2 yrs. So can u imagine how his mom or dad would feel???
RIP Phillip...your life was unforunately cut short. Ill always remember you. Thanks for making geog classes interesting, the entertainment in the gym and just seeing ur happy, smiling face around college. Take care babes. I know ull watch over us xxx

if you aint got nothing nice to say dont say nothing at all

I used to live in Thamesmead/Woolwich area 4 years ago and crime was bad then but this is unacceptable. Im so glad I took my young children away from all this "hate" that has appeared in the UK over the last few years .... how could ANYBODY feel safe living there??

Maybe this was a case of mistaken identity? My heart goes out to this boys family & friends at this terrible heartbreaking time xxx

ACTUALLY, the boy who died is innocent as it could not have been a gang related attack as all the males in the car were each from a different area of london, I reckon it was the two boys who got trigger happy because they see boys that are not from the area.
Not all shootings are gang related because they are black people need to stop being so small minded and see the bigger pisture: WHERE ARE THESE GUNS COMING FROM???

phillip was my cousin and i know more than anyone else that he was not involved in anything gang related and what **** me off is all the reports that say "gang related shooting" phillip was a kind and loving young man and had always been since he was a child.this is a hard pill to swallow for all of our family because phillip was a connection that everyone in our family shared he was the one who never held a grudge and said it how it was and even when he said something that you didnt like he had a way of making you see his point.all of the pictures posted of phillip could never show how much of of a joker he was,from when he was a child an hour couldnt pass with phillip without him cracking a joke that you would remember for a long time.its hard to only think of the good times but that was all we ever had with phillip.and mabe i feel this way because he was my "baby" cousin but i hope whoever pulled the trigger burns in hell because they have taken an angel from us and a role model to some but most of all because some whatless badman wanabe has taken away a positive black boy who would have grown to be a positive black man in a time when there is a shortage in black men let alone positive black men.phillip i know that you are in heaven with grandma,grandpa and milly.may your souls rest in peace and be there waiting for us when god decides its our time.love you forever your cousin.Emmanuel (emmy)

Black people need to start taking responsibility for themselves, always having excuses for everything never actually manning up. Its sad...My parents have managed to raise 4 kids 3 of which are at uni or graduated and my youngest on her way...I have always been taught to be responsible for myself, to make my own choices....
But as much as we black people have to stop making excuses EVERYONE in the community, wherever it be the kids, teenages, adults, elderly, police and the government. We all have to work together to end the violence. We can all write what we want and voice our opinion's but until we take action, then nothing is going to change, but from the problem getting worse..To many kids have lost their lives...
By the way to the naive people that believe that the shootings and stabbings happened to boys who were involved in gang life, a word of advice, don't jump to conclusions, don't be so quick to judge. Someone life is precious don't belittle it by making your assumptions. No Person deserves to have their life taken from them...No matter the circumstances.
Kids please empower urself...prove that you are not all bad-breed.

You just gotta laugh...there will be increased patrols of the area...lot of good thats going to do now eh fs, the killers will be long gone, this is typical of the knee jerk reaction we can hope to expect from our clueless law enforcement ( and i use the term lightly) officers. if its not involving a motorist, easy pray, they couldnt give a stuff...but remember this, the next time you phone the cop shop and they tell you they cant spare anyone, tell them you have just shot the person concerned, watch then as every police car, copper on foot and even helicopters turn up...funny seeing how 5 minutes before they had no officers eh !

when are we going to give our young black children a chance to be a success.it is children killing children and it has to stop, how mny more families are going to have to bury their children. let us make a difference and stop the violence

tellie tubbie cops wrote:
You just gotta laugh...there will be increased patrols of the area...lot of good thats going to do now eh fs, the killers will be long gone, this is typical of the knee jerk reaction we can hope to expect from our clueless law enforcement ( and i use the term lightly) officers. if its not involving a motorist, easy pray, they couldnt give a stuff...but remember this, the next time you phone the cop shop and they tell you they cant spare anyone, tell them you have just shot the person concerned, watch then as every police car, copper on foot and even helicopters turn up...funny seeing how 5 minutes before they had no officers eh !

I'm guessing you would get a pretty major reaction from the fuz. But think about the person who needed the police more than you who has to stay in danger, just because you didnt think you should wait for the police to become available for your, what is probably in the grand scheme of things, lower priority call... Maybe you should try that rick and see how long it takes for you to be arrested for a hoax call or something. Idiot.

i miss you phills.. wrong placce, wrong time.. god punish da mali's who did it

R.I.P Philip

GOD BLESS U
SAFE!!

R.I.P

Ben wrote:
According to London Tonight this incident is something to do with gang fueds between gangs from Charlton, Thamesmead and Woolwich so th people envolved are deffinately not INNCOCENT.

the boy woz inncocent you do not know him i knew him well a good freind so why talk about sum1 u dnt even knw get ur facts right b4 u talk dnt be going round talking rubbish innconcent r.i.p Philip

quote

R.I.P

Hi Everyone
Fair Deal on Debt CIC is a non- profitable organization.We provide services as Fair deal on debt,Debt management,Debt advice,Energy efficiency,Debt counseling,Energy saving,Credit Card Debt,loan schemes,personal loan,trade credit loan scheme,consumer loan scheme,personal loan for salaried women,personal loan for real estate builder,personal loan for pensioners.
http://www.fairdealo
ndebt.com