Your say: Five years of slaughter
IN the past five years 22 young people have been killed in the News Shopper circulation area.
All of them with so much to give. All killed before they had time to realise their potential.
The News Shopper area has had to bear more than its fair share of killings - we've chosen to look at the last five years but we could have gone back further and dredged up dozens more of these senseless attacks.
Anyone can recognise that carrying a knife or gun is wrong - that's the easy part. What's more difficult is doing something about it.
After the recent killings of Jimmy Mizen and Rob Knox our website was overwhelmed with comments from readers, so now, we're asking you for more.
We want your ideas on how to stem the free flow of blood on our streets.
For our part, we will take the material you supply us with to the very top. We will gather every comment, every suggestion, every idea you come up with and put it straight in the hands of home secretary Jacqui Smith.
We're also running an online poll to
establish which one single measure you feel would make the biggest difference to this issue. This is a unique opportunity for you to tell the people running the country what you would like to see happen - use it.
Make sure you add your comments to this story and others in our Voices Against Violence section.
Or to discuss the issues raised by the campaign visit our online forums
To see our map showing all the killings click here
12:16pm Friday 27th June 2008
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CommentPosted by: chantel, welling on 1:10pm Tue 3 Jun 08
I dont know where the police get the idea that knife crime starts at home. It starts on the streets!
I dont know where the police get the idea that knife crime starts at home. It starts on the streets!
Posted by: Pink Kitten, London on 1:14pm Tue 3 Jun 08
If the punishment was harsh then these kids wouldn't think it so cool!
We need harder laws in this country to frighten people enough not to commit the crime. The law is not feared at all by these kids. Getting 'nicked' is seen as a clever thing to do because they all laugh about it.
If the punishment was harsh then these kids wouldn't think it so cool!
We need harder laws in this country to frighten people enough not to commit the crime. The law is not feared at all by these kids. Getting 'nicked' is seen as a clever thing to do because they all laugh about it.
Posted by: chantel, welling on 1:18pm Tue 3 Jun 08
People carry knives because they know they wont go to prison for long, even if they take someones life. So in their eyes they 'gain respect' and beat the system. Which is the perfect making for a gang leader, gang members follow their leader which means they will get to be like their leader if they to carry a knife this results in them doing so and probably stabbing someone to get respect. So get all the burgalars and freudstars out of prison and make some room so life actully means you will never walk the streets or be able to carry a knife again! Or bring back the death penalty, a life for a life.
People carry knives because they know they wont go to prison for long, even if they take someones life. So in their eyes they 'gain respect' and beat the system. Which is the perfect making for a gang leader, gang members follow their leader which means they will get to be like their leader if they to carry a knife this results in them doing so and probably stabbing someone to get respect. So get all the burgalars and freudstars out of prison and make some room so life actully means you will never walk the streets or be able to carry a knife again! Or bring back the death penalty, a life for a life.
Posted by: Jayne, Bromley on 1:49pm Tue 3 Jun 08
Investment by this so called government would be a start.Get into schools now and start learning from the mistakes of the past 10 years,Grab the childrens imagination at a young age and educate them young about these horrific crimes and attitudes abound on our streets,protect the new growth and then look at dealing with the infested top parts. Give these kids something to do,start looking at dealing with the problems we already have here and stop importing more. These kids leave school with no prospects,jobs are thin on the ground,most have no ambition whatsoever,their lives revolve around a melee of cheap alcohol and standing on street corners. Violence from all walks of the media need to be looked at,You cannot frighten the youth by showing them gory pictures of stab victims,they have got more horrific photos than that stored as screensavers on their phones.Invest in local soccer teams,skate parks,pool halls,and from experience given time the tide will turn,make these kids realise that they do belong somewhere.Stop closing down every facility they have of gathering in through lack of funds.Parents need to come on board here,educate them also not by fines or telling them they are horrific monster breeding scum get them involved also,any child caught doing wrong should be made attend courses with BOTH parents.Could I ask the government why they give children in youth detention centres pocket money ? I have worked with youth crime for over 12 years now,does the government not realise that we see it all at a grass roots level,a 12 month sentence in a YDC and their alloted pocket money not spent for the duration is a new x box to these kids who just cannot afford such luxuries paid to them in cash when they are released!Get the kids who have been thrown out of school into units immediately not left for 12-18 months at home till they are unmanageable.And finally bring back some good old fashioned discipline into our schools,give teachers back the right to use discipline to control their classrooms,You have tried the way of the "[bold]do gooders[/bold] " we are now reaping the merits of years of that approach.
Investment by this so called government would be a start.Get into schools now and start learning from the mistakes of the past 10 years,Grab the childrens imagination at a young age and educate them young about these horrific crimes and attitudes abound on our streets,protect the new growth and then look at dealing with the infested top parts. Give these kids something to do,start looking at dealing with the problems we already have here and stop importing more. These kids leave school with no prospects,jobs are thin on the ground,most have no ambition whatsoever,their lives revolve around a melee of cheap alcohol and standing on street corners. Violence from all walks of the media need to be looked at,You cannot frighten the youth by showing them gory pictures of stab victims,they have got more horrific photos than that stored as screensavers on their phones.Invest in local soccer teams,skate parks,pool halls,and from experience given time the tide will turn,make these kids realise that they do belong somewhere.Stop closing down every facility they have of gathering in through lack of funds.Parents need to come on board here,educate them also not by fines or telling them they are horrific monster breeding scum get them involved also,any child caught doing wrong should be made attend courses with BOTH parents.Could I ask the government why they give children in youth detention centres pocket money ? I have worked with youth crime for over 12 years now,does the government not realise that we see it all at a grass roots level,a 12 month sentence in a YDC and their alloted pocket money not spent for the duration is a new x box to these kids who just cannot afford such luxuries paid to them in cash when they are released!Get the kids who have been thrown out of school into units immediately not left for 12-18 months at home till they are unmanageable.And finally bring back some good old fashioned discipline into our schools,give teachers back the right to use discipline to control their classrooms,You have tried the way of the "
do gooders " we are now reaping the merits of years of that approach.
Posted by: Dannii_x, Thamesmead on 1:50pm Tue 3 Jun 08
One of these people was my dear frined Buster! It needs to Stop! RIP Babe!
I Created a video for him and on knife crime, Please have a look for yourselves www.youtube.com/watc
h?v=yns-YRrP8P0
Thankyou
x[bold]bold[/bold]
One of these people was my dear frined Buster! It needs to Stop! RIP Babe!
I Created a video for him and on knife crime, Please have a look for yourselves www.youtube.com/watc
h?v=yns-YRrP8P0
Thankyou
x
Posted by: Dannii_x, Thamesmead on 2:10pm Tue 3 Jun 08
www.youtube.com/watc
h?v=yns-YRrP8P0
Please Have a Look!
Thankyou
www.youtube.com/watc
h?v=yns-YRrP8P0
Please Have a Look!
Thankyou
Posted by: ben, bromley on 2:20pm Tue 3 Jun 08
I don't see how this is so hard to do. We need to bring in tough new laws to protect the public from violent knife or gun crime. Anyone who is caught carrying a knife or gun in the street, at their workplace, at school, where ever should be sentenced to at least 10 - 15 years prison. No court hearing, no mucking about just straight in! Once people realise they'll serve a long sentence for carrying a weapon they'll soon stop. Someone earlier said a life for a life, I agree. Why should a killer get 15 years in prison at taxpayers cost to be released years down the line with the potential to murder, rob or steal again. Too much taxpayers money is spent housing murderers at millions and millions of pounds when they should be ended and forgotten. I'm fed up living in a society where thugs rule the streets and terrorise everyone else. Murder is on the up so we need to crack down before it gets even more out of hand than it already has!
I don't see how this is so hard to do. We need to bring in tough new laws to protect the public from violent knife or gun crime. Anyone who is caught carrying a knife or gun in the street, at their workplace, at school, where ever should be sentenced to at least 10 - 15 years prison. No court hearing, no mucking about just straight in! Once people realise they'll serve a long sentence for carrying a weapon they'll soon stop. Someone earlier said a life for a life, I agree. Why should a killer get 15 years in prison at taxpayers cost to be released years down the line with the potential to murder, rob or steal again. Too much taxpayers money is spent housing murderers at millions and millions of pounds when they should be ended and forgotten. I'm fed up living in a society where thugs rule the streets and terrorise everyone else. Murder is on the up so we need to crack down before it gets even more out of hand than it already has!
Posted by: Reader, Bexley on 3:10pm Tue 3 Jun 08
Sadly we do have to start looking at the home life of these people, most problems do start at home when it comes to the youths either we are too trusting and take in every thing they say or not bothered to control these youths. I think that parents need to take a more active role in helping these kids that have gone off the rails direction in life, not leaving it down to other members of the public, they need to find something in life that is worth a challange. It can be done, parents moaning about the youths have no where to go are wrong their are many orginisation which these children can engage in if they took the time to look. But where do the schools come in this they are allowed to dismiss a child from education, but then pass the butt on again, if the child has the wrong support they will end up on the streets, so all schools should have to be looked at before a free hand is given to kick the kids out. Their has always been gangs of youths on our streets, but our goverment has allowed so many different cultures in intergrate without any true leadership on how to manage this. What i feel we need is maybe the army on our streets, we keep being told that our police force is so over worked what do we pay are army for but to go to other countrys which are out of control such as our own country. We are headed for such civil unrest in the country soon we will be needing something to control it, look at Belfast their seem to be less problems their than we have here. I think its about time the goverment wakes up and admit that it is out of control the first one that does gets my vote as they all seem to be pushing the blame around as far as i can see, without trying to address our needs of saftey.
Sadly we do have to start looking at the home life of these people, most problems do start at home when it comes to the youths either we are too trusting and take in every thing they say or not bothered to control these youths. I think that parents need to take a more active role in helping these kids that have gone off the rails direction in life, not leaving it down to other members of the public, they need to find something in life that is worth a challange. It can be done, parents moaning about the youths have no where to go are wrong their are many orginisation which these children can engage in if they took the time to look. But where do the schools come in this they are allowed to dismiss a child from education, but then pass the butt on again, if the child has the wrong support they will end up on the streets, so all schools should have to be looked at before a free hand is given to kick the kids out. Their has always been gangs of youths on our streets, but our goverment has allowed so many different cultures in intergrate without any true leadership on how to manage this. What i feel we need is maybe the army on our streets, we keep being told that our police force is so over worked what do we pay are army for but to go to other countrys which are out of control such as our own country. We are headed for such civil unrest in the country soon we will be needing something to control it, look at Belfast their seem to be less problems their than we have here. I think its about time the goverment wakes up and admit that it is out of control the first one that does gets my vote as they all seem to be pushing the blame around as far as i can see, without trying to address our needs of saftey.
Posted by: Sally Armee, At Work on 3:13pm Tue 3 Jun 08
PLEASE don't anyone say they need "understanding" and money spent on their entertainment...
...or worse, that its because they "don't have a father figure" in their lives.
They act the way they do because they are sub-human scumbags. No excuses.
PLEASE don't anyone say they need "understanding" and money spent on their entertainment...
...or worse, that its because they "don't have a father figure" in their lives.
They act the way they do because they are sub-human scumbags. No excuses.
Posted by: Ed, Greenwich on 3:58pm Tue 3 Jun 08
It's simple: 1) youths should stay in education at least until they are 18 and have a job. We need [bold]proper vocational training[/bold] for academically less talented people so that they can compete against educated and often well trained immigrants for jobs. 2) Secondly, and this is where the Government fails, there should be much more [bold]incentives for people to get an education and jobs[/bold]. The government is making the matter worse and worse by incentivising people to stay out of the job market and to "breed for benefits". 3) Tougher policing and punishments, incl life for life. Enough has been said about this.
It's simple: 1) youths should stay in education at least until they are 18 and have a job. We need
proper vocational training for academically less talented people so that they can compete against educated and often well trained immigrants for jobs. 2) Secondly, and this is where the Government fails, there should be much more
incentives for people to get an education and jobs. The government is making the matter worse and worse by incentivising people to stay out of the job market and to "breed for benefits". 3) Tougher policing and punishments, incl life for life. Enough has been said about this.
Posted by: Martin Johnson, Sidcup on 5:05pm Tue 3 Jun 08
The only way to change the situation is a whole re education programme coupled with immediate imprisonment for carrying any offensive weapon, even if it is a first offence.
Metal detectors are not the answer as many plastic knives or items could kill,
The police (Not PCSO's )also need to regularly patrol areas where youths congregate,and to regularly visit pubs and clubs to ensure their licences are being complyed with.
The whole "youth problem" dates back to the early 1980's when funding for youth clubs was cut in order to save money.
The only way to change the situation is a whole re education programme coupled with immediate imprisonment for carrying any offensive weapon, even if it is a first offence.
Metal detectors are not the answer as many plastic knives or items could kill,
The police (Not PCSO's )also need to regularly patrol areas where youths congregate,and to regularly visit pubs and clubs to ensure their licences are being complyed with.
The whole "youth problem" dates back to the early 1980's when funding for youth clubs was cut in order to save money.
Posted by: Your Lord Erastus Theobald Piggott, Piggott Place on 5:29pm Tue 3 Jun 08
Please go to the forum and leave some comments there, as [bold]Your Lord[/bold] has.
Please use this unique opportunity to have your comments read by the [bold]Home Secretary[/bold].
[bold]Your Lord, Erastus Theobald Piggott[/bold]
Please go to the forum and leave some comments there, as
Your Lord has.
Please use this unique opportunity to have your comments read by the
Home Secretary.
Your Lord, Erastus Theobald Piggott Posted by: probonopublico, sidcup on 5:54pm Tue 3 Jun 08
This business of carrying knives and guns was not in the English psyche - our feral members of society were either imprisoned or National Service put an end to their antics. This has been imported into our society along with many other bad things by minorities, many of them illegally here but still housed and pampered at our expense who have been given priority in everything and by soft touch mainly left wing governments. Now it's all coming home to roost. Everyone is now too frightened to quote the actual statistics that are staring at us in the face for fear of the racist card being played - just say what you see on your screen out loud every time the news is on - there aren't too many English people involved. But that makes me racist doesn't it rather than an Englishman driven out of London by being outnumbered
This business of carrying knives and guns was not in the English psyche - our feral members of society were either imprisoned or National Service put an end to their antics. This has been imported into our society along with many other bad things by minorities, many of them illegally here but still housed and pampered at our expense who have been given priority in everything and by soft touch mainly left wing governments. Now it's all coming home to roost. Everyone is now too frightened to quote the actual statistics that are staring at us in the face for fear of the racist card being played - just say what you see on your screen out loud every time the news is on - there aren't too many English people involved. But that makes me racist doesn't it rather than an Englishman driven out of London by being outnumbered
Posted by: Matt, bromley on 8:11pm Tue 3 Jun 08
Kids have nothing to do these days apart from roam the streets. Without sounding racist the immigration policy of the Labour government means that there are more foreign gangs to deal with and im not talking big 30yr old drug gangs im talking 18yr old kids who are trying to make an name for themselves. Just look around Bromley town centre on a Saturday. I feel sorry for the youth of today, being young has never been so hard!
Kids have nothing to do these days apart from roam the streets. Without sounding racist the immigration policy of the Labour government means that there are more foreign gangs to deal with and im not talking big 30yr old drug gangs im talking 18yr old kids who are trying to make an name for themselves. Just look around Bromley town centre on a Saturday. I feel sorry for the youth of today, being young has never been so hard!
Posted by: James Douglas, Bromley on 8:44pm Tue 3 Jun 08
Congratulations to the NewShopper for taking such a positive stance on this matter. The government need to introduce harsher sentences for carrying a gun or knife and ensure the judiciary use these harsher sentences - perhaps by making them mandatory sentences, thus taking away the option of a judge or magistrate giving a ridiculous soft sentence. There'd be an uproar from the liberal judges and magistrates, but these people are unelected and, judging by their performances, totally incapable of doing their job. We also need to immediately scrap the ridiculous Human Rights Act, which is no more than a legal tool of assistance for the criminal fraternity.
We must also be careful though that we don't unnecessarily add to people's concerns by becoming part of the current media/politician-dri
ven frenzy - comments like "We want your ideas on how to stem the free flow of blood on our streets" add to the general fear of the current climate, but don't actually reflect the reality. Ferral youths, gangs and 'street youths' who carry knives are still very much a minority amongst our young people - please don't get caught up in the Evening Standard / Daily Mail type of reporting that paints all of our young people with these generalisations - growing up is hard enough to do without being ostracised.
Congratulations to the NewShopper for taking such a positive stance on this matter. The government need to introduce harsher sentences for carrying a gun or knife and ensure the judiciary use these harsher sentences - perhaps by making them mandatory sentences, thus taking away the option of a judge or magistrate giving a ridiculous soft sentence. There'd be an uproar from the liberal judges and magistrates, but these people are unelected and, judging by their performances, totally incapable of doing their job. We also need to immediately scrap the ridiculous Human Rights Act, which is no more than a legal tool of assistance for the criminal fraternity.
We must also be careful though that we don't unnecessarily add to people's concerns by becoming part of the current media/politician-dri
ven frenzy - comments like "We want your ideas on how to stem the free flow of blood on our streets" add to the general fear of the current climate, but don't actually reflect the reality. Ferral youths, gangs and 'street youths' who carry knives are still very much a minority amongst our young people - please don't get caught up in the Evening Standard / Daily Mail type of reporting that paints all of our young people with these generalisations - growing up is hard enough to do without being ostracised.
Posted by: Missy on 9:38pm Tue 3 Jun 08
If the goverment had a bit of backbone and didn't listern to humans rights ect... and took all the TV's, videos, PC's, and all other luxerys away and keep the "lags" locked up most of the time like they used to, maybe prison wouldn't seem so appealing and maybe all these knife and gun killers would think twice about commiting a crime.
Failing that, if they want to fight so much send them out to Irac ect they could fight to there hearts content then, serve our country and may learn how to act like an adult and gain some respect for others. This country will get worse untill the goverment stand up to these scum so they realise crime is not so big after all
If the goverment had a bit of backbone and didn't listern to humans rights ect... and took all the TV's, videos, PC's, and all other luxerys away and keep the "lags" locked up most of the time like they used to, maybe prison wouldn't seem so appealing and maybe all these knife and gun killers would think twice about commiting a crime.
Failing that, if they want to fight so much send them out to Irac ect they could fight to there hearts content then, serve our country and may learn how to act like an adult and gain some respect for others. This country will get worse untill the goverment stand up to these scum so they realise crime is not so big after all
Posted by: fed up, erith, erith on 9:47pm Tue 3 Jun 08
I think all this has gone to far to rectify, kids today have no respect for people and they know that they can get away with everything, the teachers, the police, the courts all have to be Politically correct. There is no punishment for them to be scared of. Its cool to hang around in gangs (not), dont use the excuse they bored they have nothing to do, there wasnt much to do when any of us were kids we made our own entertainment, we didnt go around killing people. Films, violent games, and lack of restriction from parents are all to blame. Im worried for my children, now its a case of if they go to school will they come home.
I think all this has gone to far to rectify, kids today have no respect for people and they know that they can get away with everything, the teachers, the police, the courts all have to be Politically correct. There is no punishment for them to be scared of. Its cool to hang around in gangs (not), dont use the excuse they bored they have nothing to do, there wasnt much to do when any of us were kids we made our own entertainment, we didnt go around killing people. Films, violent games, and lack of restriction from parents are all to blame. Im worried for my children, now its a case of if they go to school will they come home.
Posted by: Mart, Sidcup on 10:11pm Tue 3 Jun 08
[quote][bold]Missy[/bold] wrote:
If the goverment had a bit of backbone and didn't listern to humans rights ect... and took all the TV's, videos, PC's, and all other luxerys away and keep the "lags" locked up most of the time like they used to, maybe prison wouldn't seem so appealing and maybe all these knife and gun killers would think twice about commiting a crime. Failing that, if they want to fight so much send them out to Irac ect they could fight to there hearts content then, serve our country and may learn how to act like an adult and gain some respect for others. This country will get worse untill the goverment stand up to these scum so they realise crime is not so big after all[/quote] I quite agree. If iwas young and unemployed then committing crime is the way to go.Even if there is a remote chance of getting caught then it would be fine going to prison, all your meals,all mod cons( 'scuse the pun) learn a trade or get educated.Prison is no longer a detterent thanks to the Lord Longfords and the mamby pamby PC brigade. Its about time the Brits stood up and said enough is enough. Bring on the General Election!
Missy wrote:
If the goverment had a bit of backbone and didn't listern to humans rights ect... and took all the TV's, videos, PC's, and all other luxerys away and keep the "lags" locked up most of the time like they used to, maybe prison wouldn't seem so appealing and maybe all these knife and gun killers would think twice about commiting a crime. Failing that, if they want to fight so much send them out to Irac ect they could fight to there hearts content then, serve our country and may learn how to act like an adult and gain some respect for others. This country will get worse untill the goverment stand up to these scum so they realise crime is not so big after all
I quite agree. If iwas young and unemployed then committing crime is the way to go.Even if there is a remote chance of getting caught then it would be fine going to prison, all your meals,all mod cons( 'scuse the pun) learn a trade or get educated.Prison is no longer a detterent thanks to the Lord Longfords and the mamby pamby PC brigade. Its about time the Brits stood up and said enough is enough. Bring on the General Election!
Posted by: Mwah, Dartford on 10:26pm Tue 3 Jun 08
"Britain Sh@gged"
Luv all comments but at end of day this country is abso sh1t. Im a white british, i sometimes feel ashamed at the fact i never emigrated..
"Britain Sh@gged"
Luv all comments but at end of day this country is abso sh1t. Im a white british, i sometimes feel ashamed at the fact i never emigrated..
Posted by: Roger, Leeds on 10:37pm Tue 3 Jun 08
Knife crime will continue and seems to be getting worse by the day, this will be the case as long as there is no suitable deterrent in place.
I feel we societity in general, should identify all of these stupid laws that always allow the criminals to avoid true punishment.
We should then all join and work together in massive numbers to force the hands of the government to get these silly liberal laws changed.
Around a general election would be a good time!
Knife crime will continue and seems to be getting worse by the day, this will be the case as long as there is no suitable deterrent in place.
I feel we societity in general, should identify all of these stupid laws that always allow the criminals to avoid true punishment.
We should then all join and work together in massive numbers to force the hands of the government to get these silly liberal laws changed.
Around a general election would be a good time!
Posted by: Roger, Leeds on 10:46pm Tue 3 Jun 08
This is some of what Simon Cowell had to say about knife crime on to the Sun I think we all agree he is 100% correct on this topic...
“If the Government and police were as attentive on knives as they are on smoking, speeding and parking, this problem would disappear in five minutes.
“You’ve got restaurant owners terrified now because of the smoking ban, you light up and you’re pounced on – it’s ridiculous.
“If it was up to me, everyone caught with a knife would get an automatic ten-year sentence.
“We wouldn’t tolerate someone walking into our house carrying a knife so why do we put up with people walking down the street with knives?”
With his usual no-nonsense attitude, Simon adds: “There is too much tolerance in Britain. We have to get tough.
This is some of what Simon Cowell had to say about knife crime on to the Sun I think we all agree he is 100% correct on this topic...
“If the Government and police were as attentive on knives as they are on smoking, speeding and parking, this problem would disappear in five minutes.
“You’ve got restaurant owners terrified now because of the smoking ban, you light up and you’re pounced on – it’s ridiculous.
“If it was up to me, everyone caught with a knife would get an automatic ten-year sentence.
“We wouldn’t tolerate someone walking into our house carrying a knife so why do we put up with people walking down the street with knives?”
With his usual no-nonsense attitude, Simon adds: “There is too much tolerance in Britain. We have to get tough.
Posted by: Karen, London on 11:19pm Tue 3 Jun 08
Dannii, saw you post above and just watched your video, Thank you x
Dannii, saw you post above and just watched your video, Thank you x
Posted by: Mad Earwig, Kent on 11:42pm Tue 3 Jun 08
After any incident like this, we all get angry and look at who to blame. We need to face up to the facts that the current teenage generation has been brought up with parents more interested in watching eastenders and football, visiting boot fairs, visiting B&Q on a sunday and aimlessly wandering around Tesco in track suits, buying ready meals and coke. So this Nintendo- McDonalds teenage generation has not been read stories to, not discovered music that is not in a download chart have had no school or home discipline, have not been shown any culture. Nor have they learned any respect for anything other than possessions like mobile phones and games. It is US that have allowed this to happen and whenever any of these nasty fighting, swearing aggressive, insecure little boys get caught...their mums and dads cannot believe it is their kid that did the deed!
Do you know where your kids are on a Saturday night? Or are you all too busy reading the Argos catalogue and watching Pop Idol to even care...
After any incident like this, we all get angry and look at who to blame. We need to face up to the facts that the current teenage generation has been brought up with parents more interested in watching eastenders and football, visiting boot fairs, visiting B&Q on a sunday and aimlessly wandering around Tesco in track suits, buying ready meals and coke. So this Nintendo- McDonalds teenage generation has not been read stories to, not discovered music that is not in a download chart have had no school or home discipline, have not been shown any culture. Nor have they learned any respect for anything other than possessions like mobile phones and games. It is US that have allowed this to happen and whenever any of these nasty fighting, swearing aggressive, insecure little boys get caught...their mums and dads cannot believe it is their kid that did the deed!
Do you know where your kids are on a Saturday night? Or are you all too busy reading the Argos catalogue and watching Pop Idol to even care...
Posted by: Matt, bromley on 7:34am Wed 4 Jun 08
[quote][bold]Mad Earwig[/bold] wrote:
After any incident like this, we all get angry and look at who to blame. We need to face up to the facts that the current teenage generation has been brought up with parents more interested in watching eastenders and football, visiting boot fairs, visiting B&Q on a sunday and aimlessly wandering around Tesco in track suits, buying ready meals and coke. So this Nintendo- McDonalds teenage generation has not been read stories to, not discovered music that is not in a download chart have had no school or home discipline, have not been shown any culture. Nor have they learned any respect for anything other than possessions like mobile phones and games. It is US that have allowed this to happen and whenever any of these nasty fighting, swearing aggressive, insecure little boys get caught...their mums and dads cannot believe it is their kid that did the deed! Do you know where your kids are on a Saturday night? Or are you all too busy reading the Argos catalogue and watching Pop Idol to even care... [/quote] You can blame the parents to a certain extent but i would say the government have more to do with this. The population is booming and the rescources are getting strained and money is getting tight. We moan that our kids play computer games all day but the alternatives are few and far between. F*** the inner cities and the suburbs. Lets all move to the country and let the scum fight it out between them.
Mad Earwig wrote:
After any incident like this, we all get angry and look at who to blame. We need to face up to the facts that the current teenage generation has been brought up with parents more interested in watching eastenders and football, visiting boot fairs, visiting B&Q on a sunday and aimlessly wandering around Tesco in track suits, buying ready meals and coke. So this Nintendo- McDonalds teenage generation has not been read stories to, not discovered music that is not in a download chart have had no school or home discipline, have not been shown any culture. Nor have they learned any respect for anything other than possessions like mobile phones and games. It is US that have allowed this to happen and whenever any of these nasty fighting, swearing aggressive, insecure little boys get caught...their mums and dads cannot believe it is their kid that did the deed! Do you know where your kids are on a Saturday night? Or are you all too busy reading the Argos catalogue and watching Pop Idol to even care...
You can blame the parents to a certain extent but i would say the government have more to do with this. The population is booming and the rescources are getting strained and money is getting tight. We moan that our kids play computer games all day but the alternatives are few and far between. F*** the inner cities and the suburbs. Lets all move to the country and let the scum fight it out between them.
Posted by: Mark, Dartford on 8:38am Wed 4 Jun 08
[quote][bold]Matt[/bold] wrote:
Kids have nothing to do these days apart from roam the streets. Without sounding racist the immigration policy of the Labour government means that there are more foreign gangs to deal with and im not talking big 30yr old drug gangs im talking 18yr old kids who are trying to make an name for themselves. Just look around Bromley town centre on a Saturday. I feel sorry for the youth of today, being young has never been so hard![/quote] So what was the difference, say, twenty years ago?
Kids have nothing to do, because they choose that.If youth centres are established, they burn them down, for a quick thrill!
With the easy access of computers, activity days,mobiles,educati
on should be a lot easier, than it was then.
You should feel sorry for the youth of past times, who had nothing to do, but still did not resort to stabbings and drug use.
Matt wrote:
Kids have nothing to do these days apart from roam the streets. Without sounding racist the immigration policy of the Labour government means that there are more foreign gangs to deal with and im not talking big 30yr old drug gangs im talking 18yr old kids who are trying to make an name for themselves. Just look around Bromley town centre on a Saturday. I feel sorry for the youth of today, being young has never been so hard!
So what was the difference, say, twenty years ago?
Kids have nothing to do, because they choose that.If youth centres are established, they burn them down, for a quick thrill!
With the easy access of computers, activity days,mobiles,educati
on should be a lot easier, than it was then.
You should feel sorry for the youth of past times, who had nothing to do, but still did not resort to stabbings and drug use.
Posted by: G on 8:58am Wed 4 Jun 08
Bring back [bold]National Service[/bold] and apply a disclaimer when the child is enrolled so that parents cannot [italic]whinge[/italic] when there [italic]precious 'angel'[/italic] is locked in a cell overnight or given a beasting for playing up and generally being a nuisance to the rest of the lads and gals. Kids need LOADS of physical activity and mental stimulus to keep them driven and positive and an updated form of National Service will prepare them to a less selfish lifestyle and teach them the value of 'pulling together' as a team and a valuable member of society! They won't have 1 father figure but maybe a dozen and I honestly believe kids these days [bold]lack the authority and respect[/bold] that 'leaders' in a National Service' can offer and impose! If nothing else it will prepare them for an [bold]active and positive future,[/bold] teach [bold]self-discipline[/bold] and will have the double benefit of putting youngsters to good use within their commuity whilst teaching them [bold]valuable skills[/bold] at the same time!
Bring back
National Service and apply a disclaimer when the child is enrolled so that parents cannot
whinge when there
precious 'angel' is locked in a cell overnight or given a beasting for playing up and generally being a nuisance to the rest of the lads and gals. Kids need LOADS of physical activity and mental stimulus to keep them driven and positive and an updated form of National Service will prepare them to a less selfish lifestyle and teach them the value of 'pulling together' as a team and a valuable member of society! They won't have 1 father figure but maybe a dozen and I honestly believe kids these days
lack the authority and respect that 'leaders' in a National Service' can offer and impose! If nothing else it will prepare them for an
active and positive future, teach
self-discipline and will have the double benefit of putting youngsters to good use within their commuity whilst teaching them
valuable skills at the same time!
Posted by: G, Gravesend on 9:14am Wed 4 Jun 08
And while I am on a roll here, I think that newcoming youth in this country should also be enrolled into National Service to serve this country as a pre-requisite to citizenship status. All immigrants except those clearly unable should work for a minimum of five years. They should pay taxes before they are entitled to any benefits, free NHS except emergency aid, similar to France's stance. This will ease the disgruntled feelings of our people and show that the government are concerned and active about the improvement of this country. Zero tolerance with knives and guns without licence impose a short sentence for carriers of such offending items and order them to work on a chain gang like in America. This will improve our roads etc. at material cost and in a way charge the offender with the cost of thier crime as they will have their liberty taken away and recieve no wages for their labour. Yes?
And while I am on a roll here, I think that newcoming youth in this country should also be enrolled into National Service to serve this country as a pre-requisite to citizenship status. All immigrants except those clearly unable should work for a minimum of five years. They should pay taxes before they are entitled to any benefits, free NHS except emergency aid, similar to France's stance. This will ease the disgruntled feelings of our people and show that the government are concerned and active about the improvement of this country. Zero tolerance with knives and guns without licence impose a short sentence for carriers of such offending items and order them to work on a chain gang like in America. This will improve our roads etc. at material cost and in a way charge the offender with the cost of thier crime as they will have their liberty taken away and recieve no wages for their labour. Yes?
Posted by: Martin, Dartford on 9:52am Wed 4 Jun 08
One possible solution to this, and several other problems with our disintegrating society, is the re-introduction of National Service.
This is expensive, but could be funded in the following manner:
1) Scrap the Territorial Army.
2) Approach the Underwriters and ask them how much they pay out on vandalism/ life insurance/ theft/ burglary claims (lets call it £4 Billion a year)
split the difference with the Underwriters - take £2 billion off them. Scrap some of the useless Quangos and ineffective schemes.
3) Divert funding from the Benefits system (because there will be a lot less incapacity and job-seekers claims)
4) Scrap the PCSO scheme
- and there is the funding!!
It does seem to me that this Government is unwilling to actually achieve anything (and looks on-course to miss its "raison D'etre" of achieving re-election!)
The benefits of National Service to this country would be numerous and far-reaching:
Providing well rounded healthy young people to the job market.
Disrupting gang culture.
Massively decreasing "low level" crime.
Massively decreasing Benefits payments.
A possible spin-off could be on the imigration front - Make it compulsory for all imigrants to do a spell of National Service before qualifying for National Health etc. ????
I'm sure that there would be many other benefits to lots of different Government Departments and parts of society.
So, I don't accept the argument "It would be too expensive to implement" especially when this Goverment thinks nothing about chucking £50 Billion at a private company (N.R)
And, importantly, would have a positive impact on stabbing/ shooting/ and drink driving statistics on the under 25's. It would also "tick the box" on the Governments "fear of crime and fear of the causes of crime"
One possible solution to this, and several other problems with our disintegrating society, is the re-introduction of National Service.
This is expensive, but could be funded in the following manner:
1) Scrap the Territorial Army.
2) Approach the Underwriters and ask them how much they pay out on vandalism/ life insurance/ theft/ burglary claims (lets call it £4 Billion a year)
split the difference with the Underwriters - take £2 billion off them. Scrap some of the useless Quangos and ineffective schemes.
3) Divert funding from the Benefits system (because there will be a lot less incapacity and job-seekers claims)
4) Scrap the PCSO scheme
- and there is the funding!!
It does seem to me that this Government is unwilling to actually achieve anything (and looks on-course to miss its "raison D'etre" of achieving re-election!)
The benefits of National Service to this country would be numerous and far-reaching:
Providing well rounded healthy young people to the job market.
Disrupting gang culture.
Massively decreasing "low level" crime.
Massively decreasing Benefits payments.
A possible spin-off could be on the imigration front - Make it compulsory for all imigrants to do a spell of National Service before qualifying for National Health etc. ????
I'm sure that there would be many other benefits to lots of different Government Departments and parts of society.
So, I don't accept the argument "It would be too expensive to implement" especially when this Goverment thinks nothing about chucking £50 Billion at a private company (N.R)
And, importantly, would have a positive impact on stabbing/ shooting/ and drink driving statistics on the under 25's. It would also "tick the box" on the Governments "fear of crime and fear of the causes of crime"
Posted by: Dannii_x, Thamesmead on 11:38am Wed 4 Jun 08
www.youtube.com/watc
h?v=yns-YRrP8P0
Please Have a Look!
Thankyou
www.youtube.com/watc
h?v=yns-YRrP8P0
Please Have a Look!
Thankyou
Posted by: me, at home on 1:31pm Wed 4 Jun 08
Go away Danni you are boring us and we are trying to have a discussion.You have already told us the website twice - if we had wanted to look we would have
Go away Danni you are boring us and we are trying to have a discussion.You have already told us the website twice - if we had wanted to look we would have
Posted by: cassie, bromley on 2:05pm Wed 4 Jun 08
me, at home - you should learn some manners, your post is a terrible example to young people
dannii is clearly a young person who has had personal experience of a close friend being murdered - personal experience of the very issue being discussed yet you just dismiss her - and clearly she is still very upset by this loss
i've watched her video - it is very good dannii - and in it she has put this messaage -
if you are someone who carries a knife have a think to yourself, imagine it was you and you lost a relative or friend, think of the pain you would go through and then feel what we feel
dannii has put her time and effort into trying to do something positive and i think you should give her much credit for that, and encourage her and those who do such, instead of being rude and grossly insensitve
me, at home - you should learn some manners, your post is a terrible example to young people
dannii is clearly a young person who has had personal experience of a close friend being murdered - personal experience of the very issue being discussed yet you just dismiss her - and clearly she is still very upset by this loss
i've watched her video - it is very good dannii - and in it she has put this messaage -
if you are someone who carries a knife have a think to yourself, imagine it was you and you lost a relative or friend, think of the pain you would go through and then feel what we feel
dannii has put her time and effort into trying to do something positive and i think you should give her much credit for that, and encourage her and those who do such, instead of being rude and grossly insensitve
Posted by: me, at home on 3:07pm Wed 4 Jun 08
Cassie -firstly i don't carry a knife and secondly i have lost someone and so know what it feels like.We don't need to be told 3 times about a website or a video as i said before if we wanted to look at it we could.I am not rude and i am not insensitive,i just don't want to read the same comments over & over
Cassie -firstly i don't carry a knife and secondly i have lost someone and so know what it feels like.We don't need to be told 3 times about a website or a video as i said before if we wanted to look at it we could.I am not rude and i am not insensitive,i just don't want to read the same comments over & over
Posted by: Danni_x, Thamesmead on 3:24pm Wed 4 Jun 08
Cassie, Thanks for that message, it was really sweet of you and secondly thankyou for sticking up for me.
& low life 'me' i think you are the biggest and rudest dickhead ever! So now your gonna give it all that 'i lost somebody' well frankly i dont have any sympathy for you! Im just trying to show people how much pain knife puts people through, so if you have lost somebody to a stabbing then maybe i might listen to your comments! The video is to keep my friend in memory of everybody so i dont give a toss what you say.....Im not rude and intensive but i dont want your snide little comments!
Cassie, Thanks for that message, it was really sweet of you and secondly thankyou for sticking up for me.
& low life 'me' i think you are the biggest and rudest dickhead ever! So now your gonna give it all that 'i lost somebody' well frankly i dont have any sympathy for you! Im just trying to show people how much pain knife puts people through, so if you have lost somebody to a stabbing then maybe i might listen to your comments! The video is to keep my friend in memory of everybody so i dont give a toss what you say.....Im not rude and intensive but i dont want your snide little comments!
Posted by: me, at home on 3:42pm Wed 4 Jun 08
Danni - your childish swearing just high lights the sort of person you are - i am entitled to comment as much as i want but i don't feel i need to swear or insult anybody.As for your loss- you are not the only person who has lost somebody in a stabbing.I lost somebody in a stabbing but he was innocent - he wasn't in a gang terrorising a terminally ill women with a brain tumour and 2 elderly people in their 80's.He didn't throw bricks through anyone's living room window or smash anyone's car and he didn't go with a gang of yob's and committ arson on anyones property.He he didn't participate in beating up a disabled man & his carer while they were waiting for a train.Not all victims of stabbing's are entirely innocent,you have heard the saying 'what goes round comes round'.
Danni - your childish swearing just high lights the sort of person you are - i am entitled to comment as much as i want but i don't feel i need to swear or insult anybody.As for your loss- you are not the only person who has lost somebody in a stabbing.I lost somebody in a stabbing but he was innocent - he wasn't in a gang terrorising a terminally ill women with a brain tumour and 2 elderly people in their 80's.He didn't throw bricks through anyone's living room window or smash anyone's car and he didn't go with a gang of yob's and committ arson on anyones property.He he didn't participate in beating up a disabled man & his carer while they were waiting for a train.Not all victims of stabbing's are entirely innocent,you have heard the saying 'what goes round comes round'.
Posted by: cassie, bromley on 4:55pm Wed 4 Jun 08
[italic]firstly i don't carry a knife[/italic]
i didn't say you did, my point was that dannii had taken time and bother to try to do something to stop violent crime
[italic]secondly i have lost someone and so know what it feels like[/italic]
seems strange to me that you say you've lost someone yet don't understand why someone would feel very strongly about trying to stop knife/violent crime, strange that then you have no empathy with her determination to push an anti-violence message
[italic]We don't need to be told 3 times about a website or a video as i said before if we wanted to look at it we could.[/italic]
as above and enthusiasm to stop violence should be valued more highly than the 'bother' of simply scrolling past a very short post
[italic]I am not rude and i am not insensitive[/italic]
you was in your post
[italic]i just don't want to read the same comments over & over[/italic]
aw diddums, her posts were hardly 'war and peace', in fact they were just a few words -
what is more important, the 'bother' to you of reading a handful of words or trying to stop violence crime?
what is more important, the 'bother' to you of reading a handful of words or encouraging young people to be enthusiastic about stopping violent crime?
firstly i don't carry a knife
i didn't say you did, my point was that dannii had taken time and bother to try to do something to stop violent crime
secondly i have lost someone and so know what it feels like
seems strange to me that you say you've lost someone yet don't understand why someone would feel very strongly about trying to stop knife/violent crime, strange that then you have no empathy with her determination to push an anti-violence message
We don't need to be told 3 times about a website or a video as i said before if we wanted to look at it we could.
as above and enthusiasm to stop violence should be valued more highly than the 'bother' of simply scrolling past a very short post
I am not rude and i am not insensitive
you was in your post
i just don't want to read the same comments over & over
aw diddums, her posts were hardly 'war and peace', in fact they were just a few words -
what is more important, the 'bother' to you of reading a handful of words or trying to stop violence crime?
what is more important, the 'bother' to you of reading a handful of words or encouraging young people to be enthusiastic about stopping violent crime?
Posted by: Danni_x, Thamesmead on 4:56pm Wed 4 Jun 08
Once again there is someone in this community who seems to think they no someone inside out when they dont! You never knew my friend and to say he done all that when you dont no him at all and your blatently wrong! so why dont you grow up a little! All of them things must be bothering you in your little mind! I would keep an eye on your son, he maybee up to no good!
Once again there is someone in this community who seems to think they no someone inside out when they dont! You never knew my friend and to say he done all that when you dont no him at all and your blatently wrong! so why dont you grow up a little! All of them things must be bothering you in your little mind! I would keep an eye on your son, he maybee up to no good!
Posted by: Danni_x, Thamesmead on 4:58pm Wed 4 Jun 08
Thanks for your support Cassie! It means alot x
Thanks for your support Cassie! It means alot x
Posted by: Danni_x, Thamesmead on 5:01pm Wed 4 Jun 08
www.youtube.com/watc
h?v=yns-YRrP8P0
Please Have a Look!
Thankyou
www.youtube.com/watc
h?v=yns-YRrP8P0
Please Have a Look!
Thankyou
Posted by: Mother, Bexley on 5:07pm Wed 4 Jun 08
[quote][bold]me[/bold] wrote:
Danni - your childish swearing just high lights the sort of person you are - i am entitled to comment as much as i want but i don't feel i need to swear or insult anybody.As for your loss- you are not the only person who has lost somebody in a stabbing.I lost somebody in a stabbing but he was innocent - he wasn't in a gang terrorising a terminally ill women with a brain tumour and 2 elderly people in their 80's.He didn't throw bricks through anyone's living room window or smash anyone's car and he didn't go with a gang of yob's and committ arson on anyones property.He he didn't participate in beating up a disabled man & his carer while they were waiting for a train.Not all victims of stabbing's are entirely innocent,you have heard the saying 'what goes round comes round'.[/quote] Well you should start to pay attention to Danni coz their is also a saying it goes Stick and stones will break my bones but names will never hurt me. We need people to express what pain all these killings have done what ever way helps at least she is not sitting their saying oh well its not my problem. Why are you venting all you anger on someone which is trying to help, this is the problem we have people screaming no-ones doing anything, have you thought about given up your time to do something constructive to help these youths move forward. I now no you thinking why should I, but unless we all work together to help the situation nothing will change because it take's all of us Parents,Teachers, and all that are involed with kids on a daly basis to try to turn these kids around if it is possable it has to be worth a try. Maybe just maybe if you were to take the time to watch this video you may start to understand other people's feelings more instead of thinking just of yourself
me wrote:
Danni - your childish swearing just high lights the sort of person you are - i am entitled to comment as much as i want but i don't feel i need to swear or insult anybody.As for your loss- you are not the only person who has lost somebody in a stabbing.I lost somebody in a stabbing but he was innocent - he wasn't in a gang terrorising a terminally ill women with a brain tumour and 2 elderly people in their 80's.He didn't throw bricks through anyone's living room window or smash anyone's car and he didn't go with a gang of yob's and committ arson on anyones property.He he didn't participate in beating up a disabled man & his carer while they were waiting for a train.Not all victims of stabbing's are entirely innocent,you have heard the saying 'what goes round comes round'.
Well you should start to pay attention to Danni coz their is also a saying it goes Stick and stones will break my bones but names will never hurt me. We need people to express what pain all these killings have done what ever way helps at least she is not sitting their saying oh well its not my problem. Why are you venting all you anger on someone which is trying to help, this is the problem we have people screaming no-ones doing anything, have you thought about given up your time to do something constructive to help these youths move forward. I now no you thinking why should I, but unless we all work together to help the situation nothing will change because it take's all of us Parents,Teachers, and all that are involed with kids on a daly basis to try to turn these kids around if it is possable it has to be worth a try. Maybe just maybe if you were to take the time to watch this video you may start to understand other people's feelings more instead of thinking just of yourself
Posted by: cassie, bromley on 5:17pm Wed 4 Jun 08
[italic]your childish swearing just high lights the sort of person you are[/italic]
your rudeness and gross insensitivity just highlights the sort of person you are
it was your original, totally unnecessary, rudeness which started it - not only are you showing a terrible example to young people but you don't like the taste of your own medicine
your childish swearing just high lights the sort of person you are
your rudeness and gross insensitivity just highlights the sort of person you are
it was your original, totally unnecessary, rudeness which started it - not only are you showing a terrible example to young people but you don't like the taste of your own medicine
Posted by: dawn on 5:48pm Wed 4 Jun 08
[quote][bold]me[/bold] wrote:
Danni - your childish swearing just high lights the sort of person you are - i am entitled to comment as much as i want but i don\'t feel i need to swear or insult anybody.As for your loss- you are not the only person who has lost somebody in a stabbing.I lost somebody in a stabbing but he was innocent - he wasn\'t in a gang terrorising a terminally ill women with a brain tumour and 2 elderly people in their 80\'s.He didn\'t throw bricks through anyone\'s living room window or smash anyone\'s car and he didn\'t go with a gang of yob\'s and committ arson on anyones property.He he didn\'t participate in beating up a disabled man & his carer while they were waiting for a train.Not all victims of stabbing\'s are entirely innocent,you have heard the saying \'what goes round comes round\'.[/quote] to me...
firstly i don`t think that you have read all the news on julian buster knight if you have then you would know that he was not in any gangs did not go out looking for trouble .... and for all the comments that you put on this comments above was not him. i was there in the court and heard everything that was said ... buster was a innocent young lad ..and i will not sit here and have a slanging match with you ... buster was my son`s friend and did not have any weapons or go out and look for trouble...for you to sit there and say wot goes around comes around your just behind the people that carry knife`s and thats what we all want to stop......very very anrgy...
me wrote:
Danni - your childish swearing just high lights the sort of person you are - i am entitled to comment as much as i want but i don\'t feel i need to swear or insult anybody.As for your loss- you are not the only person who has lost somebody in a stabbing.I lost somebody in a stabbing but he was innocent - he wasn\'t in a gang terrorising a terminally ill women with a brain tumour and 2 elderly people in their 80\'s.He didn\'t throw bricks through anyone\'s living room window or smash anyone\'s car and he didn\'t go with a gang of yob\'s and committ arson on anyones property.He he didn\'t participate in beating up a disabled man & his carer while they were waiting for a train.Not all victims of stabbing\'s are entirely innocent,you have heard the saying \'what goes round comes round\'.
to me...
firstly i don`t think that you have read all the news on julian buster knight if you have then you would know that he was not in any gangs did not go out looking for trouble .... and for all the comments that you put on this comments above was not him. i was there in the court and heard everything that was said ... buster was a innocent young lad ..and i will not sit here and have a slanging match with you ... buster was my son`s friend and did not have any weapons or go out and look for trouble...for you to sit there and say wot goes around comes around your just behind the people that carry knife`s and thats what we all want to stop......very very anrgy...
Posted by: dawn on 5:55pm Wed 4 Jun 08
[quote][bold]Danni_x[/bold] wrote:
www.youtube.com/watc h?v=yns-YRrP8P0 Please Have a Look! Thankyou[/quote] well done danni
the video you done for buster was very special and thats why we all want knife crime to stop ....
there are alot of people behind you...
Danni_x wrote:
www.youtube.com/watc h?v=yns-YRrP8P0 Please Have a Look! Thankyou
well done danni
the video you done for buster was very special and thats why we all want knife crime to stop ....
there are alot of people behind you...
Posted by: Nadine on 6:00pm Wed 4 Jun 08
I am so hurt that so many young peoples lives are being taken so casualy, its so apparent now that a life meas nothing to young people the same way a 17 year girl can walk into an abortion clinic and get rid of her un-born child the same way these kids run into peoples houses with guns and knives and MURDER someone in there sleep. These kids need to face the reality of life they cant expect to ROLL on the streets with an knife cs the same knife will turn back on them. I cant stand the fact that no one is taking acountability 4 the horrific events taking place round the corner from more or less everyone.
I am so hurt that so many young peoples lives are being taken so casualy, its so apparent now that a life meas nothing to young people the same way a 17 year girl can walk into an abortion clinic and get rid of her un-born child the same way these kids run into peoples houses with guns and knives and MURDER someone in there sleep. These kids need to face the reality of life they cant expect to ROLL on the streets with an knife cs the same knife will turn back on them. I cant stand the fact that no one is taking acountability 4 the horrific events taking place round the corner from more or less everyone.
Posted by: jacqui on 7:14pm Wed 4 Jun 08
we need a huge investment in our children and young people to even begin to tackle this problem. Read the article by the director of Kids Company (Times Online) it is the best explanation I have seen about how to address youth violence. I would also like to see an open police station in Sidcup and borough wide "ambassadors" like thay have in Sheffield who patrol areas and can mediate until police arrive.
we need a huge investment in our children and young people to even begin to tackle this problem. Read the article by the director of Kids Company (Times Online) it is the best explanation I have seen about how to address youth violence. I would also like to see an open police station in Sidcup and borough wide "ambassadors" like thay have in Sheffield who patrol areas and can mediate until police arrive.
Posted by: Demi, London on 8:05pm Wed 4 Jun 08
Another youth has been stabbed in Greenwich within the last hour, it seems to be getting worse.
Another youth has been stabbed in Greenwich within the last hour, it seems to be getting worse.
Posted by: HAPPY PATROL, Dartford on 9:36pm Wed 4 Jun 08
I have read everybody’s comments on this subject and they are all doing the same thing.
Blaming the next generation.
It is the same old story, blame it on the kids, blame the government, blame the parents.
Kids have nothing to do so we blame them.
When these kids become adults, they will be blaming the kids of the next generation.
It is about time the adults of today take responsibility for their kids actions.
Ask where there going.
Ask what they are doing.
Ask whom they are with.
Check what they are carrying, knife or no kniife.
Then the Adults blame each other and the government because of the kids it is a vicious circle.
HOWEVER,
There is minority of British society cannot be bothered. “IT’S NOT MY PROBLEM” Attitude.
USA HAS THE GUN.
UK HAS THE KNIFE.
BRING BACK STOP AND SEARCH...
IT IS TIME WE ALL TOOK RESPONSIBILITY.
I have read everybody’s comments on this subject and they are all doing the same thing.
Blaming the next generation.
It is the same old story, blame it on the kids, blame the government, blame the parents.
Kids have nothing to do so we blame them.
When these kids become adults, they will be blaming the kids of the next generation.
It is about time the adults of today take responsibility for their kids actions.
Ask where there going.
Ask what they are doing.
Ask whom they are with.
Check what they are carrying, knife or no kniife.
Then the Adults blame each other and the government because of the kids it is a vicious circle.
HOWEVER,
There is minority of British society cannot be bothered. “IT’S NOT MY PROBLEM” Attitude.
USA HAS THE GUN.
UK HAS THE KNIFE.
BRING BACK STOP AND SEARCH...
IT IS TIME WE ALL TOOK RESPONSIBILITY.
Posted by: Missy on 10:40pm Wed 4 Jun 08
[quote][bold]Martin[/bold] wrote:
One possible solution to this, and several other problems with our disintegrating society, is the re-introduction of National Service.
This is expensive, but could be funded in the following manner:
1) Scrap the Territorial Army.
2) Approach the Underwriters and ask them how much they pay out on vandalism/ life insurance/ theft/ burglary claims (lets call it £4 Billion a year)
split the difference with the Underwriters - take £2 billion off them. Scrap some of the useless Quangos and ineffective schemes.
3) Divert funding from the Benefits system (because there will be a lot less incapacity and job-seekers claims)
4) Scrap the PCSO scheme
- and there is the funding!!
It does seem to me that this Government is unwilling to actually achieve anything (and looks on-course to miss its "raison D'etre" of achieving re-election!)
The benefits of National Service to this country would be numerous and far-reaching:
Providing well rounded healthy young people to the job market.
Disrupting gang culture.
Massively decreasing "low level" crime.
Massively decreasing Benefits payments.
A possible spin-off could be on the imigration front - Make it compulsory for all imigrants to do a spell of National Service before qualifying for National Health etc. ????
I'm sure that there would be many other benefits to lots of different Government Departments and parts of society.
So, I don't accept the argument "It would be too expensive to implement" especially when this Goverment thinks nothing about chucking £50 Billion at a private company (N.R)
And, importantly, would have a positive impact on stabbing/ shooting/ and drink driving statistics on the under 25's. It would also "tick the box" on the Governments "fear of crime and fear of the causes of crime"[/quote] I couldn't have put that better myself Martin. Well done. I will just add for BOYS and GIRLS
Martin wrote:
One possible solution to this, and several other problems with our disintegrating society, is the re-introduction of National Service.
This is expensive, but could be funded in the following manner:
1) Scrap the Territorial Army.
2) Approach the Underwriters and ask them how much they pay out on vandalism/ life insurance/ theft/ burglary claims (lets call it £4 Billion a year)
split the difference with the Underwriters - take £2 billion off them. Scrap some of the useless Quangos and ineffective schemes.
3) Divert funding from the Benefits system (because there will be a lot less incapacity and job-seekers claims)
4) Scrap the PCSO scheme
- and there is the funding!!
It does seem to me that this Government is unwilling to actually achieve anything (and looks on-course to miss its "raison D'etre" of achieving re-election!)
The benefits of National Service to this country would be numerous and far-reaching:
Providing well rounded healthy young people to the job market.
Disrupting gang culture.
Massively decreasing "low level" crime.
Massively decreasing Benefits payments.
A possible spin-off could be on the imigration front - Make it compulsory for all imigrants to do a spell of National Service before qualifying for National Health etc. ????
I'm sure that there would be many other benefits to lots of different Government Departments and parts of society.
So, I don't accept the argument "It would be too expensive to implement" especially when this Goverment thinks nothing about chucking £50 Billion at a private company (N.R)
And, importantly, would have a positive impact on stabbing/ shooting/ and drink driving statistics on the under 25's. It would also "tick the box" on the Governments "fear of crime and fear of the causes of crime"
I couldn't have put that better myself Martin. Well done. I will just add for BOYS and GIRLS
Posted by: cassie, bromley on 10:52pm Wed 4 Jun 08
[italic]Thanks for your support Cassie![/italic]
you're very welcome, good for you taking time to try to do something positive :)
Thanks for your support Cassie!
you're very welcome, good for you taking time to try to do something positive :)
Posted by: hollie, bromley on 10:57pm Wed 4 Jun 08
firstly this site is to try and stop arguments and war that turn into death. and all i have read is arguments i think there are some childish people on here that need to go back to school themselves. if Danni has a video and wants to keep posting it then let her keep you sad and perfetic comments to yourself. ok now back to what this website is for,im only 21 and really think people should start listening to the younger generation its rubbish when people say kids carry knifes because they feel they have to,they carry knifes because they want to. its got to the point were kids carry knifes and guns because its become cool well lets stop and think there no it aint bloody cool never has been and never will be. now how to stop this maybe by the police doing there job, since i was walking the streets the police have always been interested in giving kids stick for climbing in to a park when its closed or spitting on the floor which yes is nasty but all the time there out picking on the kids that are just being kids, another kid or young adult is being killed. my brother was beaten up a few months ago to the point of nearly having to have plastic surgery so we went to the police did it the right way and the boy who did it didnt even get a fine.and no it was not even his first offence. there is the problem they start with there fist they get away with that and then they keep climbing the ladder until they have killed someone. this all comes down to people not talking when the war starts on there street or their estate.that is your home sometimes even your family speak up we need to hear you. at 14 i can remember a girl pulling a blade on me at a under 18s disco, i was lucky i walked away but others are losing their lives. we all need to come together, i have never been one for keeping my mouth shut and yes sometimes that aint the best but im not willing to sit back and watch this until god for bid its my friend or family member. people that even say the words im going to shoot you or im going to stab you should be put in prison and left there because half of them would never think of even using them words again let alone doing it. it should be like saying the word bomb in an airport because we dont need terrorist coming to bomb us we have our own walking the streets.
firstly this site is to try and stop arguments and war that turn into death. and all i have read is arguments i think there are some childish people on here that need to go back to school themselves. if Danni has a video and wants to keep posting it then let her keep you sad and perfetic comments to yourself. ok now back to what this website is for,im only 21 and really think people should start listening to the younger generation its rubbish when people say kids carry knifes because they feel they have to,they carry knifes because they want to. its got to the point were kids carry knifes and guns because its become cool well lets stop and think there no it aint bloody cool never has been and never will be. now how to stop this maybe by the police doing there job, since i was walking the streets the police have always been interested in giving kids stick for climbing in to a park when its closed or spitting on the floor which yes is nasty but all the time there out picking on the kids that are just being kids, another kid or young adult is being killed. my brother was beaten up a few months ago to the point of nearly having to have plastic surgery so we went to the police did it the right way and the boy who did it didnt even get a fine.and no it was not even his first offence. there is the problem they start with there fist they get away with that and then they keep climbing the ladder until they have killed someone. this all comes down to people not talking when the war starts on there street or their estate.that is your home sometimes even your family speak up we need to hear you. at 14 i can remember a girl pulling a blade on me at a under 18s disco, i was lucky i walked away but others are losing their lives. we all need to come together, i have never been one for keeping my mouth shut and yes sometimes that aint the best but im not willing to sit back and watch this until god for bid its my friend or family member. people that even say the words im going to shoot you or im going to stab you should be put in prison and left there because half of them would never think of even using them words again let alone doing it. it should be like saying the word bomb in an airport because we dont need terrorist coming to bomb us we have our own walking the streets.
Posted by: cassie, bromley on 11:05pm Wed 4 Jun 08
[italic]There is minority of British society cannot be bothered. “IT’S NOT MY PROBLEM” Attitude....IT IS TIME WE ALL TOOK RESPONSIBILITY[/italic]
the problem is though that there are, and always will be, some people who won't take responsibility, whose moral code is self-interest not what is morally right
govt must take responsibility for the moral lead...which is what most people expect and want the govt to do
There is minority of British society cannot be bothered. “IT’S NOT MY PROBLEM” Attitude....IT IS TIME WE ALL TOOK RESPONSIBILITY
the problem is though that there are, and always will be, some people who won't take responsibility, whose moral code is self-interest not what is morally right
govt must take responsibility for the moral lead...which is what most people expect and want the govt to do
Posted by: Kathy, Gravesend on 11:29pm Wed 4 Jun 08
So much to say but where to start!!
It is time the goverement allowed parents teachers police the power to deal with the teenagers without fear of reprisals.They need to know when the do wrong they will be punished,and no they cannot start preaching there human rights because all the time they act like children and try to bring fear into every day, life they have no rights.When they respect people people will respect them.
Parents teach them manners and start turning the telly OFF at meal times and BE a family, sit around the table and talk.It always worked so it would again.Bring rules in at home again please before we have a world no-one wants to live in.
Stop super markets selling any drink after certain hours (we always did have that rule)and never on a Sunday.Make it really hard for them to get the **** drink.All night pubs for drinking does NOT work and the clubs should also close at a certain hour.The knife crime IS due to drink and drugs, deal with it NOW.Proper sentances if caught with a knife(boot camps would be good) and if using it throw the book at them.
If just one judge had one of there family knifed do you really think the culbrit would get away with it!!!!
Lets try and let our teenages see that its ok if they must to swear when together but when in public no way,this however also applies to some of the older generation as well!!
Lets get a dress code again it all helps when put to gether even though you may think it funny.
The only reason they are like this is that they have no diration at all and so need our help we are letting them down.
If someone famous is seen with drugs arrest them and charge them, just like they would you and me if we where caught, now that would be a good role model!! It would be saying "I do not care who you are you CANNOT get away with abusing the system".
The do gooders must take a run and jump because it is them that are hurting our children by jumping in to save them when all it does is hurt them more,what seems good at 13 is not great when they are 18!!
If a child of 14 has a child do not give them a flat or money,make them live with there parents (give the parents alitte extra cash to help).There are exceptions to every rule but a child who has a child cannot bring them up as they have not learnt much themselfs.
Must go as I could keep this rant up all night but so wish I had some control in this life as I know I could help in some way or other,but no its all in the lap of FOOLS.
yours sincerely
KJFederl
So much to say but where to start!!
It is time the goverement allowed parents teachers police the power to deal with the teenagers without fear of reprisals.They need to know when the do wrong they will be punished,and no they cannot start preaching there human rights because all the time they act like children and try to bring fear into every day, life they have no rights.When they respect people people will respect them.
Parents teach them manners and start turning the telly OFF at meal times and BE a family, sit around the table and talk.It always worked so it would again.Bring rules in at home again please before we have a world no-one wants to live in.
Stop super markets selling any drink after certain hours (we always did have that rule)and never on a Sunday.Make it really hard for them to get the **** drink.All night pubs for drinking does NOT work and the clubs should also close at a certain hour.The knife crime IS due to drink and drugs, deal with it NOW.Proper sentances if caught with a knife(boot camps would be good) and if using it throw the book at them.
If just one judge had one of there family knifed do you really think the culbrit would get away with it!!!!
Lets try and let our teenages see that its ok if they must to swear when together but when in public no way,this however also applies to some of the older generation as well!!
Lets get a dress code again it all helps when put to gether even though you may think it funny.
The only reason they are like this is that they have no diration at all and so need our help we are letting them down.
If someone famous is seen with drugs arrest them and charge them, just like they would you and me if we where caught, now that would be a good role model!! It would be saying "I do not care who you are you CANNOT get away with abusing the system".
The do gooders must take a run and jump because it is them that are hurting our children by jumping in to save them when all it does is hurt them more,what seems good at 13 is not great when they are 18!!
If a child of 14 has a child do not give them a flat or money,make them live with there parents (give the parents alitte extra cash to help).There are exceptions to every rule but a child who has a child cannot bring them up as they have not learnt much themselfs.
Must go as I could keep this rant up all night but so wish I had some control in this life as I know I could help in some way or other,but no its all in the lap of FOOLS.
yours sincerely
KJFederl
Posted by: me, at home on 8:31am Thu 5 Jun 08
Dawn - in reply to your comment did i mention the name Julian Buster Knight ??? no i didn't.I wonder why you would think that my comments referred to this person.
Dawn - in reply to your comment did i mention the name Julian Buster Knight ??? no i didn't.I wonder why you would think that my comments referred to this person.
Posted by: Im talking to you, everywhere on 9:42am Thu 5 Jun 08
[quote][bold]me[/bold] wrote:
Dawn - in reply to your comment did i mention the name Julian Buster Knight ??? no i didn't.I wonder why you would think that my comments referred to this person.[/quote] FYI when someone has been killed, the murderer's friends like to fabricate stories about the person who was killed asthough they were a bad person in an attempt to condone their friends behaviour.
This is exactly what happened in Buster's case, the murderers friends tried to tarnish Buster's name in order to defend the fact that their friend went out and killed someone.
If you look at boys behaviour when they are growing up then all boys do silly things like smash up bus shelters or phone boxes. Graffitti walls, torment people. It used to go on when I was young, when my father was young and when his father was young.
Does it mean that these boys deserved to be killed?
me wrote:
Dawn - in reply to your comment did i mention the name Julian Buster Knight ??? no i didn't.I wonder why you would think that my comments referred to this person.
FYI when someone has been killed, the murderer's friends like to fabricate stories about the person who was killed asthough they were a bad person in an attempt to condone their friends behaviour.
This is exactly what happened in Buster's case, the murderers friends tried to tarnish Buster's name in order to defend the fact that their friend went out and killed someone.
If you look at boys behaviour when they are growing up then all boys do silly things like smash up bus shelters or phone boxes. Graffitti walls, torment people. It used to go on when I was young, when my father was young and when his father was young.
Does it mean that these boys deserved to be killed?
Posted by: genie on 10:38am Thu 5 Jun 08
Lets start with the basics really, BRING BACK A MARY WHITEHOUSE. All violent games, videos, and tv programmes should be banned.What people (and I say people because its not just teenagers here adults play, and watch these vile things to) feed thier minds or their children with this rotten stuff, would you feed your self a stinking, mouldy,maggott ridden pork chop for dinner No, because it would affect your health, the mind is no different, what you feed into it is no different. We have alot of youths running around our city streets living out video/games that they play, except this is no game, and you cant stop and replay. The Justice system in this country is letting each and every individual down YOU AND ME. Whats the answer? NO HUMAN HAS IT.
Lets start with the basics really, BRING BACK A MARY WHITEHOUSE. All violent games, videos, and tv programmes should be banned.What people (and I say people because its not just teenagers here adults play, and watch these vile things to) feed thier minds or their children with this rotten stuff, would you feed your self a stinking, mouldy,maggott ridden pork chop for dinner No, because it would affect your health, the mind is no different, what you feed into it is no different. We have alot of youths running around our city streets living out video/games that they play, except this is no game, and you cant stop and replay. The Justice system in this country is letting each and every individual down YOU AND ME. Whats the answer? NO HUMAN HAS IT.
Posted by: Jade, Bromley on 1:55pm Thu 5 Jun 08
I agree that something needs to be done, but arent we forgetting thats its not only kids comitting knife and gun crime- its adults too!!
I agree that something needs to be done, but arent we forgetting thats its not only kids comitting knife and gun crime- its adults too!!
Posted by: me, at home on 2:23pm Thu 5 Jun 08
Im talking to you -
I said 'did i mention the name Julian Buster Knight' and the answer is NO i didn't,why would my comments make you think i was referring to this person?? All i said in my original comment is that not everyone who has been murdered is innocent.Some people do terrible things and i am not talking about graffiti and kicking bus shelter's,this results in come backs from the original victims.When a person is killed there are 2 sides to the story but the media only want us to hear the details of the person who has lost their life.Every time a person is murdered the press portray them as saints - 'they were going to be an arcitect,they were going to university they went to church every day'.I am not saying that anyone deserves to be murdered and i would not comment unless i knew fully both sides of the story.
Im talking to you -
I said 'did i mention the name Julian Buster Knight' and the answer is NO i didn't,why would my comments make you think i was referring to this person?? All i said in my original comment is that not everyone who has been murdered is innocent.Some people do terrible things and i am not talking about graffiti and kicking bus shelter's,this results in come backs from the original victims.When a person is killed there are 2 sides to the story but the media only want us to hear the details of the person who has lost their life.Every time a person is murdered the press portray them as saints - 'they were going to be an arcitect,they were going to university they went to church every day'.I am not saying that anyone deserves to be murdered and i would not comment unless i knew fully both sides of the story.
Posted by: katie on 3:04pm Thu 5 Jun 08
'me at home' i think you should keep your pathetic little comments to yourself as they are not interesting and no one cares.
'me at home' i think you should keep your pathetic little comments to yourself as they are not interesting and no one cares.
Posted by: Mercy, South East London on 3:45pm Thu 5 Jun 08
The Crime rate in this country is an EPIDEMIC! I don't know what the MPs are doing in the parliament. if they spend 4 hours in the Parliament, 3 of those 4 hours should be dedicated to solving these crimes. because their children are not affected, they don't know how it feels. most of them are either gay, single, living alone or having their children live in a controlled bubble environment because they can afford it.
What needs to be done is this: If anyone kills or attempts to kill anyone, they should be put to death straight away. [bold]NO MATTER THEIR AGE[/bold] Anyone old enough to kill a human being is old enough to die! [bold]No mercy for the merciless!!![/bold] Even such death would be too easy for them. A special prison should be built for murderers and when they are caught, they should be thrown in that prison and left to die by starvation so that they have enough time to suffer like their victim did. After they are dead, their bodies should be used to feed the dogs or as manure. They don't even deserved to be buried.
These stupid, cowardly murderers have nothing to fear as it is now. by the time the Government takes these drastic measures, they will know that there are consequences no matter how young they are and they will sit tight. It is simple! By the time about 10 murderers are killed themselves by starvation, EVERYONE will see the crime rates drop like a brick! Britain needs to give more power and rights to parents, because these children don't even respect their parents. Can you imagine children being taught to call the police if smacked by their parents? Even the bible says "Spare the Rod and spoil the child". Children who grow up knowing they can't be punished by their parents ultimately grow up not to fear the Law of the Country. SIMPLE!!!
And all you parents who need parenting yourself, SET GOOD EXAMPLES for your children! most rotten children we see today are a mirror of what their parents are truly like. You see a 2 and a half year old child using swear words, where do you think he/she got it from? his parent/s of course! Children are like sponges, they soak in what their see and hear from their parents.
Especially you single mothers out there. I am a mother myself, but please live a life worthy of honor and praise that your children may follow. Don't live your life like a home based prostitute/drunk. you are single, but it is not an excuse to mess up and mess your children up.
As for the Government, make it easier for couples to stay together! Make it easier for families to live, especially married couples. So that they don't have to work day and night so that they barely have time to invest in the children. PLEASE!!!!!!! Break the family, break the society and hence the country. The Government has been breaking the family with it's policies. It is hard for the husband to work and support his family, the wife has to work long hours too. What happens to the children then? They are left hanging, bored....find someone to drink with, smoke, have illicit sex, join gangs, pick fights, kill people.
This is the Country where I will hear a mother say to me that she is worse off taking her partner back into the home, because it is costing her more and she having to pay for everything through her nose and work longer and longer. And she has a 1 and half year old child. CAN YOU IMAGINE! Now she tells me that she is seriously considering kicking her husband out so that she can get benefits and work less and spend more quality time with her child. That poor child will now grow up without her dad for no good reason. [bold]Every child needs a father and a mother otherwise women will get pregnant without a sperm. If it takes a Sperm to make, then it will take a sperm to raise! BUILD OUR HOMES BACK AGAIN!!![/bold]
Bottom line, ANYONE; man, woman, old or young who kills a human being should be S[bold]ENTENCED TO DEATH!!![/bold]
The Crime rate in this country is an EPIDEMIC! I don't know what the MPs are doing in the parliament. if they spend 4 hours in the Parliament, 3 of those 4 hours should be dedicated to solving these crimes. because their children are not affected, they don't know how it feels. most of them are either gay, single, living alone or having their children live in a controlled bubble environment because they can afford it.
What needs to be done is this: If anyone kills or attempts to kill anyone, they should be put to death straight away.
NO MATTER THEIR AGE Anyone old enough to kill a human being is old enough to die!
No mercy for the merciless!!! Ev
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